What I don't understand about the Stanley Gryziec case.... - Sitcoms Online Message Boards

hostedbyrobertstack · 06-24-2011, 12:37 AM

I have watched this segment numerous times over the years. The thing that I find odd, is that they still haven't cracked this case. Reason being, if Patsy Peck, the bookstore owner, had spoken to these 2 men in her bookstore and they were obviously acquainted with her husband, how does he/she not know the names of these two individuals??? This is the part that does not make sense. Any thoughts?

DarkDante · 06-24-2011, 12:54 AM

I was going to post something similar and just kept putting it off. This case baffles me on a number of levels.

First there seems to be evidence of either shoddy police work or a police cover up in how they handled the crime scene. The insistence on the part of the police that Gryziec was stabbed to death when no stab wounds were found on his body to me is extremely interesting.

The next point of contention is the fact that the suspects in this case are believed to have been known to the police and were still alive at the time of the UM airing (1990) and they apparently knew where this individual could be located but were wary about providing any more details regarding this individual for reasons they did not disclose to the public. In addition the UM broadcast brought in over 300 tips in regards to the Gryziec case.

I've been trying to figure out exactly what the connection is with the bar and Gryziec's murder. The UM segment alleged potential narcotics trafficking that may have taken place in the bar which resulted in the bar's liquor license being revoked. I've been trying like mad to find out the name of the bar that Gryziec's brother owned with no success. I think finding the name of the bar might be a good jumping off point to finding out more information on this case.

DarkDante · 06-24-2011, 01:03 AM

The following was posted by "The Third Man" a few years ago:

Post Standard (Syracuse) January 6, 1991

A Central New York man is suspected of committing a 14-year-old murder featured on the NBC television series "Unsolved Mysteries" three months ago.

William Kernan, an assistant district attorney in Oneida County, declined to name the male suspect. The man is living in the Syracuse-Utica area and might not know he is suspected of the Nov. 6, 1976 fatal shooting of Stanley Gryziec in his South Street home in Rome, Kernan said.

"He hasn't hired a lawyer," Kernan said. "On some days I say, 'You know we could still possibly get an indictment.' On other days you think, 'No. We're never going to get an indictment because so many of the prime witnesses are deceased or have moved away."'

Oneida County Sheriff's Investigator Robert Saunders and Rome city police Investigator John Keys have received about 320 telephone calls from people who saw the "Unsolved Mysteries" episode Oct. 10 and claim to have information about Gryziec, who was 59 when he died.

"FIFTY PERCENT of what came in was advantageous," Saunders said. "A lot of it was repetitious. . . . We still get about two calls a week."

The death of Gryziec -- owner of a liquor store and manager of a car dealership -- initially was believed to be a robbery gone awry. The case was reopened in 1987 after new evidence surfaced during an unrelated arson investigation. Saunders said he now believes Gryziec might have been the innocent victim of a local crime ring.

He said the murderer might have killed the wrong man or went after Gryziec to keep him from revealing information about illegal activities. Gryziec was killed by two men in ski masks who burst into his home late at night, handcuffed his wife, choked her until she fell unconscious and shot him in the chest. His wife, Esther Gryziec, died of natural causes 23 months later.

SEVERAL PEOPLE have asked the investigators to test fire their .25-caliber automatic handguns -- the same caliber as the gun that killed Gryziec, Saunders said. The gun owners are worried that the murder could be pinned on them because they own similar guns, he said.

Saunders and Keys are still looking for Charles Bucrzinski, a potential witness who jumped bail in 1977 when he was being tried in Oneida County on drug-related charges, Saunders said. A composite sketch of Bucrzinski was aired during the 18-minute "Unsolved Mysteries" segment called "The Man who Knew too Much."

"WE HAVEN'T gotten anything new on him. We are really very interested in talking to him," Saunders said.

Saunders and Keys have been assigned to the case full-time and are working out of the Oneida County District Attorney's Office. The pair is expected to complete the investigation in February. Saunders, Keys and Kernan will then review the evidence and decide whether they have enough to charge the suspect, Kernan said.

Post-Standard (Syracuse) October 12, 1990

The morning after the television show "Unsolved Mysteries" focused on a murder here 14 years ago, police revealed that they might have their man.

"We think we know who did it, but we're not at liberty to talk about his whereabouts," Police Chief Edward Cretaro said Thursday. "That was the whole purpose of the show, to get more information, to button it up."

The 18-minute segment of the hour-long show featured a re-enactment of the murder of Stanley Gryziec. The program generated about 150 telephone calls nationwide from people offering information on the crime, Cretaro said.

Cretaro said his department has a suspect, but not enough evidence to convict that person of a crime.

"We have enough to indict, but probably not enough to convict," Cretaro said. "We don't want to indict without a conviction."

Gryziec was 59 when he was shot and killed Nov. 6, 1976, in his home in south Rome. His wife, Esther, was tied up in the kitchen while two men ransacked the house. She died of natural causes two years later.

Victoria81 · 01-13-2014, 12:03 PM

Watching this now!

MegtheEgg86 · 01-14-2014, 02:32 AM

This segment has always scared me. From everything I've ever read about Stanley Gryziec in newspaper archives, he seemed like a gracious, honest, hardworking man. I remember one of his daughters saying something to the effect of "his being honest was the cause of his death"--the implication being that he was about to shine a lot of light on some illegal activities allegedly going on at that bar Peter Gryziec owned and operated.

I don't know what to think. The fact that they were so interested in talking to Chuck Brucrzinski, a former bar employee who also just so happened to skip bail on a drug charge, might be a little telling. The Rome Police Department's (by all accounts) less-than-stellar 1976 investigation is very troubling.

Ultimately, I think a LOT more information on Peter Gryziec would be most helpful. As would the uncut version of Patsy Peck's UM interview--or shoot, anything to explain the relationship she and her husband had with those two men.

TheCars1986 · 01-14-2014, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegtheEgg86

Ultimately, I think a LOT more information on Peter Gryziec would be most helpful. As would the uncut version of Patsy Peck's UM interview--or shoot, anything to explain the relationship she and her husband had with those two men.

I agree. The answers lie with Peter. I believe Stanley was killed to be silenced on what he knew about what was going on at the bar.

DarkDante · 01-14-2014, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheCars1986

I agree. The answers lie with Peter. I believe Stanley was killed to be silenced on what he knew about what was going on at the bar.

I'm still trying to get an exact location of where that bar is or more than likely was. I'd be interested to know if it's near where Gryziec lived or in a seedier area of town?

TheCars1986 · 01-14-2014, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkDante

I'm still trying to get an exact location of where that bar is or more than likely was. I'd be interested to know if it's near where Gryziec lived or in a seedier area of town?

I may be remembering incorrectly, but I believe there is a main Stanley Gryziec thread where someone found the location of Gryziec's home, the gas station, and the bar. I definitely remember seeing a picture of the home/gas station because whoever owns it now converted the gas station (but the structure is still the same).

MegtheEgg86 · 01-14-2014, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheCars1986

I may be remembering incorrectly, but I believe there is a main Stanley Gryziec thread where someone found the location of Gryziec's home, the gas station, and the bar. I definitely remember seeing a picture of the home/gas station because whoever owns it now converted the gas station (but the structure is still the same).

Just the house and the garage. I don't think anyone here has found the bar yet because none of us have unearthed an address for it so far. Post #13:

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=279342

dynoguy88 · 01-14-2014, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegtheEgg86

Just the house and the garage. I don't think anyone here has found the bar yet because none of us have unearthed an address for it so far. Post #13:

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/...d.php?t=279342

The address of the house is 608 S. James Street in Rome New York. The gas station next door is on the corner of S. James and S. Street for those that would like to check out the area on Google maps.

WishfulDreamer · 01-19-2014, 02:43 AM

I also find this case really unsettling. The obvious coverup (not finding the shell of the gun, calling it a stab wound) and rift between Stanley and Peter make it all the more creepy. Two brothers who had always been close not speaking again even though Peter was deathly ill? I think the theory that shady stuff was going on at his bar makes total sense here. I think Stanley was killed to keep him quiet over it.

Mystery Man · 01-19-2014, 08:17 PM

Yeah, this case was really sad. He seemed like a great guy.

I had no idea they actually had suspects, though. That's good to know. I have a hankering they were probably responsible.

TheCars1986 · 01-20-2014, 12:29 PM

Seems to me like there should be enough evidence to warrant an arrest. You have the drug dealer eyewitness who said someone approached him to burglarize the Gryziec home, the neighbor to the Gryziec's who saw two men getting into a white car, the neighbor also claimed that she was followed by the same men she saw near Gryziec's home, another witness at a bar witnessed a guy who saw a man he knew had two strange men (who matched the composite sketches) money and then the men left the bar, and then you have the bookstore lady who's husband knew both men. With the exception of the drug dealer (whose credibility would be questioned at a trial), there's still 3-4 other witnesses who could identify these men as the murderers of Stanley.

DarkDante · 11-03-2014, 12:20 AM

Here is a quick and somewhat random/bizarre update on the Gryziec case:

There is a Rome, NY forum hosted by the Topix community where community members have been discussing an unrelated crime that occurred in the area.

Around halfway through the thread a forum user brought up the Gryziec case and basically summarized the case stating the following:

On November 6, 1976 Stanley Gryziec was shot and killed in his home on South James Street in Rome, NY. His wife, Esther, was tied up during the murder She died about two years later. This is another "unsolved" murder in the City of Rome. Most older Roman's know who did this, maybe not the actual shooter but who was behind it. Actually it was an attempt to collect gambling debt's incurred by Stanly's brother but that's another story. Point is, people know who was behind the murder but no one was ever arrested. Moot point now since the person who put the wheels in motion that ended up with this killing is now dead himself, old age.
Same sort of business as the (I've withheld the names of the victims in the unrelated crimes) killings but different crime groups. One group was involved in illegal gambling, the other in illegal drugs. Both groups ran their illegal businesses more or less under the noses of the cops before and after the killings with little interference. Their customers also must have known who was responsible but chose not to cooperate with the police either because they were afraid or more likely, because they wanted to continue buying drugs or gambling.

Shortly after posting this message, the OP met some resistance from other forum members who called into question what he had posted. He responded by posting the following information:

Everything posted is truth?? I am pretty sure (I've withheld the name of the individual the OP named as a suspect) did the Grysiec murder, his car was seen parked outside - again, maybe not pulling the trigger but right there at the scene. Why he wasn't arrested? Who knows?? His brother was scared ****less and never gave up the info he had which would have led to possibly an arrest.
I may be nuts but not crazy - and the matters are known by first hand knowledge of some of the facts and reading up on the rest. What part of the original statement/post do you think is street myth? what part an outright lie? Stanley Gryseic did nothing to get shot over, the thugs thought they could scare him into paying off his brother's debt - Period.

Here is a link to the Topix forum for those who want more information:
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/rome...8AKAKPV84LF/p4

dynoguy88 · 11-03-2014, 11:28 AM

Assuming that guy is right, the story makes sense. I wish we could have found out more about Stanley's brother. You would think Stanley's three kids (all of whom were interviewed in the segment) would have demanded their uncle tell them everything he knew.

Reading that old article at the top of the thread, I was surprised to find out Stanley was only 59 when he was murdered. I always assumed he was much older.

01-14-2014, 02:32 AM	#5
MegtheEgg86 Member Forum Veteran Join Date: Jun 19, 2008 Location: The Volunteer State Posts: 5,156	This segment has always scared me. From everything I've ever read about Stanley Gryziec in newspaper archives, he seemed like a gracious, honest, hardworking man. I remember one of his daughters saying something to the effect of "his being honest was the cause of his death"--the implication being that he was about to shine a lot of light on some illegal activities allegedly going on at that bar Peter Gryziec owned and operated. I don't know what to think. The fact that they were so interested in talking to Chuck Brucrzinski, a former bar employee who also just so happened to skip bail on a drug charge, might be a little telling. The Rome Police Department's (by all accounts) less-than-stellar 1976 investigation is very troubling. Ultimately, I think a LOT more information on Peter Gryziec would be most helpful. As would the uncut version of Patsy Peck's UM interview--or shoot, anything to explain the relationship she and her husband had with those two men.
	__________________ "Why is she lying?, it makes me wonder. What is she hiding?, it makes me wonder." Go Vols!

11-03-2014, 12:20 AM	#14
DarkDante Member Senior Member Join Date: Jul 27, 2002 Posts: 1,569	An Update Here is a quick and somewhat random/bizarre update on the Gryziec case: There is a Rome, NY forum hosted by the Topix community where community members have been discussing an unrelated crime that occurred in the area. Around halfway through the thread a forum user brought up the Gryziec case and basically summarized the case stating the following: On November 6, 1976 Stanley Gryziec was shot and killed in his home on South James Street in Rome, NY. His wife, Esther, was tied up during the murder She died about two years later. This is another "unsolved" murder in the City of Rome. Most older Roman's know who did this, maybe not the actual shooter but who was behind it. Actually it was an attempt to collect gambling debt's incurred by Stanly's brother but that's another story. Point is, people know who was behind the murder but no one was ever arrested. Moot point now since the person who put the wheels in motion that ended up with this killing is now dead himself, old age. Same sort of business as the (I've withheld the names of the victims in the unrelated crimes) killings but different crime groups. One group was involved in illegal gambling, the other in illegal drugs. Both groups ran their illegal businesses more or less under the noses of the cops before and after the killings with little interference. Their customers also must have known who was responsible but chose not to cooperate with the police either because they were afraid or more likely, because they wanted to continue buying drugs or gambling. Shortly after posting this message, the OP met some resistance from other forum members who called into question what he had posted. He responded by posting the following information: Everything posted is truth?? I am pretty sure (I've withheld the name of the individual the OP named as a suspect) did the Grysiec murder, his car was seen parked outside - again, maybe not pulling the trigger but right there at the scene. Why he wasn't arrested? Who knows?? His brother was scared ****less and never gave up the info he had which would have led to possibly an arrest. I may be nuts but not crazy - and the matters are known by first hand knowledge of some of the facts and reading up on the rest. What part of the original statement/post do you think is street myth? what part an outright lie? Stanley Gryseic did nothing to get shot over, the thugs thought they could scare him into paying off his brother's debt - Period. Here is a link to the Topix forum for those who want more information: http://www.topix.com/forum/city/rome...8AKAKPV84LF/p4

06-24-2011, 12:37 AM	#1
hostedbyrobertstack Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Feb 23, 2007 Location: OH Posts: 436	What I don't understand about the Stanley Gryziec case.... I have watched this segment numerous times over the years. The thing that I find odd, is that they still haven't cracked this case. Reason being, if Patsy Peck, the bookstore owner, had spoken to these 2 men in her bookstore and they were obviously acquainted with her husband, how does he/she not know the names of these two individuals??? This is the part that does not make sense. Any thoughts?

06-24-2011, 12:54 AM	#2
DarkDante Member Senior Member Join Date: Jul 27, 2002 Posts: 1,569	I was going to post something similar and just kept putting it off. This case baffles me on a number of levels. First there seems to be evidence of either shoddy police work or a police cover up in how they handled the crime scene. The insistence on the part of the police that Gryziec was stabbed to death when no stab wounds were found on his body to me is extremely interesting. The next point of contention is the fact that the suspects in this case are believed to have been known to the police and were still alive at the time of the UM airing (1990) and they apparently knew where this individual could be located but were wary about providing any more details regarding this individual for reasons they did not disclose to the public. In addition the UM broadcast brought in over 300 tips in regards to the Gryziec case. I've been trying to figure out exactly what the connection is with the bar and Gryziec's murder. The UM segment alleged potential narcotics trafficking that may have taken place in the bar which resulted in the bar's liquor license being revoked. I've been trying like mad to find out the name of the bar that Gryziec's brother owned with no success. I think finding the name of the bar might be a good jumping off point to finding out more information on this case.

06-24-2011, 01:03 AM	#3
DarkDante Member Senior Member Join Date: Jul 27, 2002 Posts: 1,569	The following was posted by "The Third Man" a few years ago: Post Standard (Syracuse) January 6, 1991 A Central New York man is suspected of committing a 14-year-old murder featured on the NBC television series "Unsolved Mysteries" three months ago. William Kernan, an assistant district attorney in Oneida County, declined to name the male suspect. The man is living in the Syracuse-Utica area and might not know he is suspected of the Nov. 6, 1976 fatal shooting of Stanley Gryziec in his South Street home in Rome, Kernan said. "He hasn't hired a lawyer," Kernan said. "On some days I say, 'You know we could still possibly get an indictment.' On other days you think, 'No. We're never going to get an indictment because so many of the prime witnesses are deceased or have moved away."' Oneida County Sheriff's Investigator Robert Saunders and Rome city police Investigator John Keys have received about 320 telephone calls from people who saw the "Unsolved Mysteries" episode Oct. 10 and claim to have information about Gryziec, who was 59 when he died. "FIFTY PERCENT of what came in was advantageous," Saunders said. "A lot of it was repetitious. . . . We still get about two calls a week." The death of Gryziec -- owner of a liquor store and manager of a car dealership -- initially was believed to be a robbery gone awry. The case was reopened in 1987 after new evidence surfaced during an unrelated arson investigation. Saunders said he now believes Gryziec might have been the innocent victim of a local crime ring. He said the murderer might have killed the wrong man or went after Gryziec to keep him from revealing information about illegal activities. Gryziec was killed by two men in ski masks who burst into his home late at night, handcuffed his wife, choked her until she fell unconscious and shot him in the chest. His wife, Esther Gryziec, died of natural causes 23 months later. SEVERAL PEOPLE have asked the investigators to test fire their .25-caliber automatic handguns -- the same caliber as the gun that killed Gryziec, Saunders said. The gun owners are worried that the murder could be pinned on them because they own similar guns, he said. Saunders and Keys are still looking for Charles Bucrzinski, a potential witness who jumped bail in 1977 when he was being tried in Oneida County on drug-related charges, Saunders said. A composite sketch of Bucrzinski was aired during the 18-minute "Unsolved Mysteries" segment called "The Man who Knew too Much." "WE HAVEN'T gotten anything new on him. We are really very interested in talking to him," Saunders said. Saunders and Keys have been assigned to the case full-time and are working out of the Oneida County District Attorney's Office. The pair is expected to complete the investigation in February. Saunders, Keys and Kernan will then review the evidence and decide whether they have enough to charge the suspect, Kernan said. Post-Standard (Syracuse) October 12, 1990 The morning after the television show "Unsolved Mysteries" focused on a murder here 14 years ago, police revealed that they might have their man. "We think we know who did it, but we're not at liberty to talk about his whereabouts," Police Chief Edward Cretaro said Thursday. "That was the whole purpose of the show, to get more information, to button it up." The 18-minute segment of the hour-long show featured a re-enactment of the murder of Stanley Gryziec. The program generated about 150 telephone calls nationwide from people offering information on the crime, Cretaro said. Cretaro said his department has a suspect, but not enough evidence to convict that person of a crime. "We have enough to indict, but probably not enough to convict," Cretaro said. "We don't want to indict without a conviction." Gryziec was 59 when he was shot and killed Nov. 6, 1976, in his home in south Rome. His wife, Esther, was tied up in the kitchen while two men ransacked the house. She died of natural causes two years later.

01-13-2014, 12:03 PM	#4
Victoria81 Member Frequent Poster Join Date: Jun 20, 2011 Posts: 340	Watching this now!

01-19-2014, 02:43 AM	#11
WishfulDreamer Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 01, 2009 Location: L.A. Posts: 3,868	I also find this case really unsettling. The obvious coverup (not finding the shell of the gun, calling it a stab wound) and rift between Stanley and Peter make it all the more creepy. Two brothers who had always been close not speaking again even though Peter was deathly ill? I think the theory that shady stuff was going on at his bar makes total sense here. I think Stanley was killed to keep him quiet over it.

01-20-2014, 12:29 PM	#13
TheCars1986 #VLSKMS Forum Fanatic Join Date: Nov 22, 2008 Location: Maryland Posts: 8,615	Seems to me like there should be enough evidence to warrant an arrest. You have the drug dealer eyewitness who said someone approached him to burglarize the Gryziec home, the neighbor to the Gryziec's who saw two men getting into a white car, the neighbor also claimed that she was followed by the same men she saw near Gryziec's home, another witness at a bar witnessed a guy who saw a man he knew had two strange men (who matched the composite sketches) money and then the men left the bar, and then you have the bookstore lady who's husband knew both men. With the exception of the drug dealer (whose credibility would be questioned at a trial), there's still 3-4 other witnesses who could identify these men as the murderers of Stanley.

11-03-2014, 11:28 AM	#15
dynoguy88 Member Forum 3000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 01, 2000 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 3,675	Assuming that guy is right, the story makes sense. I wish we could have found out more about Stanley's brother. You would think Stanley's three kids (all of whom were interviewed in the segment) would have demanded their uncle tell them everything he knew. Reading that old article at the top of the thread, I was surprised to find out Stanley was only 59 when he was murdered. I always assumed he was much older.