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Old 06-04-2007, 06:57 PM   #76
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Hey Crystaldawn, you and I agree. I liked what you had to say. To be honest as I said earlier on page 5, how could a person fake skull lacerations? I mean I just have a hard time believing Dorothy Wacker would be in on it and letting some unknown person whether it was Bill or someone else beating the crap out of her like that. I mean these were serious even life threatening injuries with the skull lacerations. Also that one time when Dorothy was hogtied, you cannot hogtie yourself. I dont know, I am with Crystaldawn on this one, I think it is just a serious of circumstances prevented the guy from being caught and it is amazing how some people just are not willing to accept that these people were victimized.
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Old 06-04-2007, 08:52 PM   #77
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I guess Hollow Man really was on the loose in Ohio.
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Old 06-04-2007, 09:25 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thiussat
I guess Hollow Man really was on the loose in Ohio.
You know I hear thats where he was from originally...

Last edited by crystaldawn; 06-04-2007 at 09:59 PM.
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Old 06-04-2007, 09:36 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kadrmas15
Hey Crystaldawn, you and I agree. I liked what you had to say. To be honest as I said earlier on page 5, how could a person fake skull lacerations? I mean I just have a hard time believing Dorothy Wacker would be in on it and letting some unknown person whether it was Bill or someone else beating the crap out of her like that. I mean these were serious even life threatening injuries with the skull lacerations. Also that one time when Dorothy was hogtied, you cannot hogtie yourself. I dont know, I am with Crystaldawn on this one, I think it is just a serious of circumstances prevented the guy from being caught and it is amazing how some people just are not willing to accept that these people were victimized.
It's totally possible that Dorothy had an accident in her home, like slipped in the stairs or something like that, like Crystaldawn said (btw I hope you don't hate me for disagreeing with you ) , they are elderly people, and elderly people are more prone to injure themselves if they fall. And if she did, they could have used that as evidence to backup their story; "We're not just making this up, this guy did attack Dorothy in her home you know!". Just a thought...
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Old 06-04-2007, 10:36 PM   #80
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I looked for this segment on my TiVO while ago and I must have deleted it. Can anyone tell me if any neighbors or family members of the Wackers came on the segment to back their story up?
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Old 06-05-2007, 02:47 AM   #81
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The truth is most likely nobody will ever know, it would be interesting to learn what happened in the years after the segment aired and somebody said Bill Wacker passed on- did it stop then? it may well all have been true, the most likely scenario would seem to indicate a family member being involved- how would the perpetrator know about the one blind spot when the trap was set? why did none of the neighbours see anything? many of us will be suspicious, after all if you are under siege from persons unknown why if you are an elderly woman on your own would you be willing to let a total stranger into your house without a care in the world?


Quote:
Originally Posted by kadrmas15
Hey Crystaldawn, you and I agree. I liked what you had to say. To be honest as I said earlier on page 5, how could a person fake skull lacerations? I mean I just have a hard time believing Dorothy Wacker would be in on it and letting some unknown person whether it was Bill or someone else beating the crap out of her like that. I mean these were serious even life threatening injuries with the skull lacerations. Also that one time when Dorothy was hogtied, you cannot hogtie yourself. I dont know, I am with Crystaldawn on this one, I think it is just a serious of circumstances prevented the guy from being caught and it is amazing how some people just are not willing to accept that these people were victimized.
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Old 06-05-2007, 02:59 AM   #82
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Well first Wiseguy, you couldnt be more wrong. A. ) I didnt totally dis regard everything you or anyone else that thinks an elderly couple for no apperant reason would fake such dramatic stuff to draw attention to themselves had to say.

B. You are right in that I cannot technically prove that the Wackers were victims. No need to be a smart aleck about it. I thought we were past this, I called a truce with you to be civil and apperantly you wanted to take the gloves off again so I will be more than happy to do the same. Again, you are right that I cannot prove that the Wackers were victims but since you cannot prove that they were not victims I do not think you have any more right to go about arrogantly jousting that they were faking it.

C. By the way thanks for the smart aleck comment of calling me closed minded as well. I do not think I am closed minded of course, I think anyone that really knows me can disprove that theory. It is just when I think someone has their head up their you know what, I call them out on it and am not afraid to do so. Just because I have a tendency to believe in people does not make me the bad guy.
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Old 06-05-2007, 03:08 AM   #83
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Also, in regards to the Wackers, I think people are either unable or unwilling to take into account they are from a past generation. It used to be you could actually help a person out, let them into their house, etc without having to worry about them attacking you or taking advantage of you or stealing, etc. It wouldnt even have entered this generations minds that such a thing could happen.

I didnt totally disregard anything the opposing view had to say, it is called disagreeing with you or anyone else on this forum has the perfect right to do. Just because I dont agree with you doesnt make me this horrible, close minded person which you seem to imply that I am.

I simply was stating an opinion which you not surprisingly took out of context in a desperate attempt to debunk and discredit me. I guess from now before everything I type I will say "This is my opinion, it is not necessarily fact, just my opinion from what I have seen from a segment of Unsolved mysteries."

I will give you a nickels worth of free advice. When I see something you post, no matter how stupid or arrogant or wrong I may think it is, I certainly dont have the nerve to go out of my way to paint you as a know it all even though you seem to think you are. So do me a favor, dont do it to me okay? I was stating my mere opinion, if you dont like or agree with it, that is your perfect legal right, in the future, I will ask you to respectfully restrain yourself from replying to my posts period and I will do the same with yours. Deal?



Also again Wiseguy, you are being a wiseguy, but not reading everything I was saying. I did say earlier in this thread that I believed it to be possible that it was an inside job although I personally do not agree with that theory. But of course it is possible! It is also possible the sky is pink and Bush is a smart president and it is possible that Mel Gibson is not an alcoholic and etc. I mean come on.
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Old 06-05-2007, 03:22 AM   #84
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Also I didnt do it, I dont hate you for disagreeing with me. You presented your side in a civil manner without being a jerk about it so I have no reason to dislike you. While I see what you are saying, that Dorothy being elderly could have fallen and that caused the injuries, I simply do not agree with that. I think regardless of whether it was an unknown person or Bill that Dorothy was physically assaulted.
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Old 06-05-2007, 08:54 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thiussat
I looked for this segment on my TiVO while ago and I must have deleted it. Can anyone tell me if any neighbors or family members of the Wackers came on the segment to back their story up?
The only one I remembered being interviewed besides Bill and Dorothy was one of their daughters. They did say that their daughters and I believe two of their son-in-laws did help in the "stakeout" so I assume that means they believed and supported them.

Well I see tempers are flaring again. This is one of those cases that seems to be heated like the Jeffrey MacDonald case. I know a lot of people don't agree with my opinions on this case and thats perfectly fine, I welcome the debate. If some of us can't discuss it without arguing though its probably best if you just don't post on the thread.
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Old 06-05-2007, 09:22 AM   #86
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It has been a long time since I have seen this segment, and I only remember seeing it once or twice, so I really can't give my opinions on it. Is there somewhere online where I could view it again? I remember it being a very interesting case, but I don't want to go stating any opinions about it until I've been able to view it again.
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Old 06-05-2007, 09:35 AM   #87
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It has been a long time since I have seen this segment, and I only remember seeing it once or twice, so I really can't give my opinions on it. Is there somewhere online where I could view it again? I remember it being a very interesting case, but I don't want to go stating any opinions about it until I've been able to view it again.
Well direct links aren't allowed to that website where you can view UM segments online so your best best would be to do a search on that website.
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Old 06-05-2007, 09:38 AM   #88
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Ah, I see what you mean. Thank you very much, crystaldawn.
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Old 06-05-2007, 10:51 AM   #89
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Hey wiseguy, well I am not being cocky here, I am being serious, I found your response to what I said impressive, although I didnt agree with all of it. I do apologize for the name calling, that did go to far and I do apologize for that, it was wrong and immature. However I think that you mis understood me in some things.

Like when I said things like in my opinion Ladner didnt kill himself, that is what I said, I dont see what is so wrong with that. I mean I wasnt trying to offend people when I said the Wackers were victims, that is what I think they were.

Sometimes I type things wrong, if you took offense, which I dont know why you would, I am sorry for that but I never intended to cause offense to you or anyone else with that opinion. I was merely stating an opinion. But I also think that one big area where you got it wrong was alleging I started the argument or at least that you didnt start it. You clearly were starting something, because you decided to call me close minded.

Now it was wrong for me to call you various names, again I apologize for that, but I feel you also went too far in calling me close minded. I can be close minded at times in the sense that once I form an opinion I usually stick to it.

However I do consider other people's opinions, just because I dont agree with them sometimes doesnt mean I dont agree with them. I can be abrasive at times and I have an uncanny knack for being my own worst enemy.

As for the quotes you took, a lot of which were taken out of context, that is just how I talk. I tend to type how I would talk in a conversation. Like when I said cut the crap, that is what I would say if Space Invaderz and I were talking face to face, I dont see what is so bad about that.

Also Space Invaderz and I do disagree a lot but I try to be civil there, and SI and I usually get along although we disagree quite often but I have nothing personal against SI or Thissuat for that matter. I did apologize to Thissuat earlier in this thread, I did go too far in calling him a crackpot, I knew it and I apologized for it.

Now, once again I will apologize to you, I will probably re frain from posting in response to your posts in this thread in the future since it seems to be a sour subject. However I will respond to posts of yours in other threads. I do agree with you in the Jule Caylor case for instance, and I am sorry this got personal, I think we both contributed to it becoming that way, I will be more civil to you in other threads so it is more pleasant for everyone involved and I look forward to talking with you about other cases you are a smart person that brings a lot to the board.
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Old 06-05-2007, 11:41 AM   #90
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I just re-watched this case for the first time in a long time on crystaldawn's DVDs volume 2.

At first, I would be inclined to agree with those who have suggested that the incident with the guy who stopped by to make a telephone call was unrelated to the rest of the incidents. 10 years is a long time. But, there are two problems: 1) if it was an unrelated, random robbery, why was the stuff returned, piecemeal, over the next several months? And 2) what was up with the graffiti written in crayon on the Wacker's wall: "cheaper, but will do"?

The second part still mystifies me --- I can't imagine why anyone would write such a cryptic phrase (I even looked at the possibility it was an acroynm for something else, and it's interesting to note that, but for a missing "K," you can spell Bill Wacker out of the letters in the phrase, though you are left with h, p, e, r, u, t, d, and o) --- but the first part strongly suggests that the robbery either 1) never happened or 2) was orchestrated by someone who knew the Wackers.

My best guess is that it was one or both of their sons-in-law, perhaps hiring a third party and working in cohoots. The children here would be the only people with a sensible motive: perhaps they were attempting to force the Wackers to sell and move in with one of the children's families, and in this way gain access to the cash from the sale of the house. This would even give some rational meaning to that first bit of graffiti: any history of crime drives the value of a property down, but, if the house was worth a decent amount of money before the "incidents," it would sell for "cheaper," but for the purposes of the family of one of their daughters, it "will do." It would also help to explain how the "surveillance" was cracked. Perhaps one of the sons-in-law planted the note well before any sounds were made, then did whatever he needed to do to appear to be participating in the surveillance, and finally was able to slip away from his station at the last minute just long enough to make some bangs, and then appear on the front porch with the rest of the family, leading them all to find his note while he blamed the entire incident on a disappearing "kook."

That's a stretch to explain the graffiti of course, but, like I said, if I had a guess, one or possibly both of the two sons-in-law, perhaps without the knowledge of his wife/their wives (or, then again, perhaps with her/their knowledge), was attempting to force them to sell the house and move in with his family, and hoping to then gain access to whatever cash the Wackers got from the sale. I wonder if the police ever looked into any debts either of the sons-in-law might have had.
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