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Old 03-10-2007, 09:59 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Cursiorandcursior
In my view the Springfield women are not related. I am somewhat familiar with those cases but I haven't studied them in some period of time. This particular case has less than meets the eye and should have been solved many years ago. It was primarily an incompetent police investigation. They didn't follow the leads they had and it was just a horribly botched investigation.
Im inclined to agree with you about the police investigation. However I refuse to beileve the man that took Angela just stopped there and never took anyone else. If you build a profile of the man that took her and the two women before here you have what I beileve is a serial killer lurking in southern Missouri.
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Old 03-11-2007, 02:35 AM   #32
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Im inclined to agree with you about the police investigation. However I refuse to beileve the man that took Angela just stopped there and never took anyone else. If you build a profile of the man that took her and the two women before here you have what I beileve is a serial killer lurking in southern Missouri.
Ordinarily I would agree with you, but the truth is that there were definite suspects and the case was improperly handled. The evidence does not point to a serial suspect or suspects in this particular case, although I wouldn't rule out a serial killer in other abductions and murders in that area.
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Old 03-11-2007, 09:29 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Cursiorandcursior
Ordinarily I would agree with you, but the truth is that there were definite suspects and the case was improperly handled. The evidence does not point to a serial suspect or suspects in this particular case, although I wouldn't rule out a serial killer in other abductions and murders in that area.
Interesting, could you elaborate and give me your theory on this one? Maybe you know something I don't.
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Old 03-11-2007, 11:41 AM   #34
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There was talk that the women were involved in drugs or dealing, thus the large amount of money found in the purse. Drug killings tend to be close mouthed and the victims are usually hard to find, I find it hard to believe that they were randomly abducted from their home, because if there was a killer, he would have killed them there. This was an orchestrated abduction by people they knew.
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Old 03-12-2007, 10:21 AM   #35
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There was talk that the women were involved in drugs or dealing, thus the large amount of money found in the purse. Drug killings tend to be close mouthed and the victims are usually hard to find, I find it hard to believe that they were randomly abducted from their home, because if there was a killer, he would have killed them there. This was an orchestrated abduction by people they knew.
I understand what you mean when you say "if there was a killer he would have killed them there". Keep in mind though that Angela and the other woman from Nevada where both taken and never found. We could be talking about a killer that likes to take victims back to his place and keep them alive for awhile before killing them. I admit I have not looked into all the information on the Springfield three, but I must say I find it hard to beileve that we have a drug cartel in Springfield MO that makes people just disappear, also if they owed a drug dealer money why would he not take the $800 that was left behind?
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Old 03-12-2007, 04:26 PM   #36
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Interesting, could you elaborate and give me your theory on this one? Maybe you know something I don't.
Yes, I do know. I've followed this case very closely for nearly 15 years. And the moss green van is bunk. It was dirty white. That should tell you plenty. It was drug related but not in the way you think. The suspects are known to the police and the prosecuting attorney. They have sealed the case up tight as a tick. It was not a serial killing.
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Old 03-12-2007, 09:38 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Cursiorandcursior
Yes, I do know. I've followed this case very closely for nearly 15 years. And the moss green van is bunk. It was dirty white. That should tell you plenty. It was drug related but not in the way you think. The suspects are known to the police and the prosecuting attorney. They have sealed the case up tight as a tick. It was not a serial killing.
They have sealed the case up tight as a tick, but no charges have been brought?
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Old 03-13-2007, 05:09 PM   #38
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They have sealed the case up tight as a tick, but no charges have been brought?
Yes. The Springfield Police Department or Prosecutor's office will not even talk about the case to the local newspaper. They will talk about any other unsolved cold case but not about this one. Anything that goes into this department about the case is like a huge black hole. Nothing ever comes back out.

I'm reasonably certain they know who the perps were but they will not talk about it. I believe I know who the perps are and where the bodies are likely buried but there is no way to find out what the SPD or prosecutor's office think. They won't talk about it. No a word.
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Old 03-18-2007, 09:00 AM   #39
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I understand what you mean when you say "if there was a killer he would have killed them there". Keep in mind though that Angela and the other woman from Nevada where both taken and never found. We could be talking about a killer that likes to take victims back to his place and keep them alive for awhile before killing them. I admit I have not looked into all the information on the Springfield three, but I must say I find it hard to beileve that we have a drug cartel in Springfield MO that makes people just disappear, also if they owed a drug dealer money why would he not take the $800 that was left behind?
Drugs related crimed doesnt take a cartel to accomplish. Missouri is the biggest meth state in the country. It is a hub for drugs coming out of Mexico into Texas up into Missouri. The theory of it being drug related is because that makes the most sense. So far the facts are few about that end of it. As far as the money goes, I think it was just not noticed. In my opinion whatever happened was very quick. Thats what makes it possible of being random. The girls could have been followed home. Those other abductions were spontaneous like that as well. The thing that I noticed is that those crimes occured in Missouri in 91-92 then just stopped. Which makes me believe the person responsible, moved out of the area or was incarcerated or is dead. I dont believe the Springfield 3 were taken like that, but it is possible. The van sightings may all be bunk for that matter, none of them are directly tied to the crime scene. Although one was reported to be parked at 4:30 down the street. Brown, Green, White are all potentially correct, but the TYPE of van is consistent. The time frame is hard to track, but on a Sunday morning there arent very many people out until after probably 8-9 a.m. The crime itself probably took a matter of 10-15 minutes maximum to get them out of the house. So that leaves a pretty wide window of time to take them somewhere else. With little evidence at the crime scene, it leaves people speculating. The best information lies in the background of the women and there isnt much being let out on that.
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Old 03-18-2007, 10:07 AM   #40
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Drugs related crimed doesnt take a cartel to accomplish. Missouri is the biggest meth state in the country. It is a hub for drugs coming out of Mexico into Texas up into Missouri. The theory of it being drug related is because that makes the most sense. So far the facts are few about that end of it. As far as the money goes, I think it was just not noticed. In my opinion whatever happened was very quick. Thats what makes it possible of being random. The girls could have been followed home. Those other abductions were spontaneous like that as well. The thing that I noticed is that those crimes occured in Missouri in 91-92 then just stopped. Which makes me believe the person responsible, moved out of the area or was incarcerated or is dead. I dont believe the Springfield 3 were taken like that, but it is possible. The van sightings may all be bunk for that matter, none of them are directly tied to the crime scene. Although one was reported to be parked at 4:30 down the street. Brown, Green, White are all potentially correct, but the TYPE of van is consistent. The time frame is hard to track, but on a Sunday morning there arent very many people out until after probably 8-9 a.m. The crime itself probably took a matter of 10-15 minutes maximum to get them out of the house. So that leaves a pretty wide window of time to take them somewhere else. With little evidence at the crime scene, it leaves people speculating. The best information lies in the background of the women and there isnt much being let out on that.
Your right about the abcuctions stopping after 92. That was about the time that Kenneth Allen Mcduff was arrested in Kansas City. I think it is a strong possiblity he was involved in all
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Old 03-18-2007, 01:28 PM   #41
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Your right about the abcuctions stopping after 92. That was about the time that Kenneth Allen Mcduff was arrested in Kansas City. I think it is a strong possiblity he was involved in all
I think that is unlikely. It is almost certainly related to the grave robbing charges coming up in the next week. Suzie Streeter was a prosecution witness.
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Old 03-18-2007, 02:25 PM   #42
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Your right about the abcuctions stopping after 92. That was about the time that Kenneth Allen Mcduff was arrested in Kansas City. I think it is a strong possiblity he was involved in all
I read up on that guy, he was only in KC for a couple months. I dont think that made him responsible for the women in those cases as that covered 91 and 92. There was another killer in KC at least suspected serial killer that killed prostitutes about that time. Not sure on those dates. I think Mcduff left Texas in march and was caught in May.
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Old 07-09-2007, 10:44 AM   #43
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This case hasn't been looked at here for a while. The garage floor business is still up in the air although it is disingenuous to say they could not be buried there. They could. But I personally believe the remains are elsewhere.
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:37 PM   #44
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I had never heard of this case before today, but from what I've read about it, it sounds to me as if there is precious little that is actually KNOWN. From everything coming from a reputable source that I was able to look at, the only things that can be said with any certainty are that the two girls were alive at least as late as 2:15AM (and probably at least 45 minutes to an hour after that, because they had to drive home), and the mother was alive at least as late as ~11:15PM. Other than that, it seems there is no hard evidence about anything until they were reported missing.

That's ashame, because I don't see how it will ever be solved, short of a confession, after all these years.
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Old 07-12-2007, 05:02 PM   #45
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I had never heard of this case before today, but from what I've read about it, it sounds to me as if there is precious little that is actually KNOWN. From everything coming from a reputable source that I was able to look at, the only things that can be said with any certainty are that the two girls were alive at least as late as 2:15AM (and probably at least 45 minutes to an hour after that, because they had to drive home), and the mother was alive at least as late as ~11:15PM. Other than that, it seems there is no hard evidence about anything until they were reported missing.

That's ashame, because I don't see how it will ever be solved, short of a confession, after all these years.
You're essentially correct up to a point. However, there are SOME things that are known. As to the time frames, that's pretty much on target. But here is where the investigation went wrong, in my view. And I believe it is critically important. I won't go into all of the details but let me point out that the van was almost certainly not the color that the official police version said it was; namely "moss green." A dirty white van cruised the neighborhood for three weeks prior to the abductions and when the women dissappeared, so did the van. Additionally, the "moss green" van sightings were not particularly logical in that the witnesses weren't exactly credible. So the public was looking for a van that either never existed, or the wrong color van. Without any question this was a botched investigation from the very start which even the then police chief acknowledged. So much so that the very best investigator who worked the case asked to be let off the case because it was such a mess.

I'll leave it there for the time being but that's a start in understanding the case. BTW, the case was on "48 hours" (still available from CBS), AMW and Unsolved Mysteries and perhaps several other programs. What has never definitively established is the logical motive. That I can cover in future postings. I believe it is rather clear. There are three possible scenarios that I can think of. One, in particular, is the most probable.
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