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Old 12-28-2010, 02:46 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by SageSlowdive
Then, why no trace of him has ever been found? Uh huh.
No trace of him has been found because they never really looked for him. He is not considered a fugitive and is not on any wanted posters. Look how long Eric Rudolf was able to hide and he was at the top of the FBI most wanted list. All Mike had to do was get outta town and hes vanished.
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Old 12-28-2010, 03:11 AM   #62
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Ok here's something else I just found puzzeling. Maybe someone can clear this up.
According to the unsolved mysteries wiki site the family was headed north of Tacoma to check the traps and get a tree yet Diane's body was found near Elbe which is 30 miles south of Tacoma. Either the site has this wrong or this makes Mike look even more guilty.

Here is the link. See what you guys think
http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/Diane_Robertson
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Old 12-28-2010, 04:08 AM   #63
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That whole family seemed a little skittish. But it doesn't make Mike a murderer either. I've always leaned on him being dead/innocent.

Someone would have found him alive by now. Someone would have recognized him. I do believe a serial killer could have the conscience to drop off the little girl. Maybe he was mad at Mike and Diana. That's it. It didn't involve the kid. Maybe the killer had a soft spot for kids. Diana certainly "was in the trees" like the kid said. Other than that what else could a kid provide? Would they be smart enough to say a masked man drove me to the supermarket?

In my opinion, Mike is dead.
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Old 12-28-2010, 08:30 AM   #64
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Then, why no trace of him has ever been found? Uh huh.
Ummm...there's a list of 10 Most Wanted issued by the FBI. Most of them haven't "been found" and have been missing for years. There's also the little problem w/ the police not spreading the word about Riemer fast enough, so that he was likely able to go deeper in the woods or even another country relatively unmolested.

He may have even killed himself later or died in an accident or illness in the wood and his body hasn't yet been recovered. Or it was recovered but was never matched w/ the description of Riemer and it was buried in a pauper's grave.
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Old 12-28-2010, 09:27 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by kane7474
Ok here's something else I just found puzzeling. Maybe someone can clear this up.
According to the unsolved mysteries wiki site the family was headed north of Tacoma to check the traps and get a tree yet Diane's body was found near Elbe which is 30 miles south of Tacoma. Either the site has this wrong or this makes Mike look even more guilty.

Here is the link. See what you guys think
http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/Diane_Robertson
That's correct according to the segment. Diana and the truck were found near Elbe. But remember, Mike was checking traps he may have set up over a relatively large radius, or looking for a tree over that expanse--or both--rather than just heading to the initial destination and staying there. That entire space is within the Seattle-Tacoma metro area and it all rather "runs together", much like the Knoxville, TN metro area I live in. It extends well into five different counties.
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Old 12-28-2010, 10:03 AM   #66
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I don't remember the UM segment mentioning anyone actually witnessing Riemer and Diana in the northern Tacoma area, only that's where they said they were going. Maybe Riemer checked his traps in that area, then they moved on to Elbe in search of the Christmas tree? Or maybe Diana's body wasn't dumped in Elbe until well after the fact that she was murdered? Very bizarre case.
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:16 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by Clockworkhigh
That whole family seemed a little skittish. But it doesn't make Mike a murderer either. I've always leaned on him being dead/innocent.

Someone would have found him alive by now. Someone would have recognized him. I do believe a serial killer could have the conscience to drop off the little girl. Maybe he was mad at Mike and Diana. That's it. It didn't involve the kid. Maybe the killer had a soft spot for kids. Diana certainly "was in the trees" like the kid said. Other than that what else could a kid provide? Would they be smart enough to say a masked man drove me to the supermarket?

In my opinion, Mike is dead.
Ok it seems that your basing your opinion of him being killed on the fact that he was never found. I understand where your coming from as there is some evidence that he was a victim. However I wouldnt put alot of weight on him not being found and the reason is that there never has been any real search for him. He is not considered a fugitive and the FBI has made no effort to track him down. The unsolved mysteries show was the first time his face was shown to a wide ranging national audience and it was three years after Diane's murder. Authorities thought both people where missing for three months which gave Mike plenty of time to get away and set up a new life before anyone knew Diane was dead.

You make the comment that someone would have recognized him. I would ask who?? His family? His friends? Who would recognize him and turn him in if he moved a thousand miles from where people knew him. Here's another reason that he wasnt spotted..... There is only one pic of Mike on the segment that was recent to the killing, its at a distance and you can barely see his face. Its the one where he is holding crystal. The other pics are older because you can tell he has a thick head of hair yet in the more recent pic you can tell his hair is thinning. So they dont even have a good pic of Mike to broadcast.

All it would take is one person willing to help Mike and keep their mouth shut for him to never be found. Another poster brought up the FBI ten most wanted and I agree with his thoughts on this. They can't track down people that are actively being searched for so why would anyone be suprised that they can't find someone they are not looking for?

With the serial killer theory we see that we have a killer who is murdering people and leaving bodies in plain sight. Not only that he has left a calling card so that people will know its him. Then it comes to Mike and we have no trace. For whatever reason he decides Mike's body must be hidden away?? Seems strange to me that he would take the biggest heaviest body and move it somewhere.

The blood in the truck is also a tell tale sign to me. It either means that the altercation between Mike and Diane started in the truck or it means someone with blood on them got back in that truck after getting a victims blood on them.

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Old 12-28-2010, 12:21 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by TheCars1986
I don't remember the UM segment mentioning anyone actually witnessing Riemer and Diana in the northern Tacoma area, only that's where they said they were going. Maybe Riemer checked his traps in that area, then they moved on to Elbe in search of the Christmas tree? Or maybe Diana's body wasn't dumped in Elbe until well after the fact that she was murdered? Very bizarre case.
It was not mentioned in the segment at all. It was in a newspaper article well after Diane's body was found and I really don't know if there is any truth to it or who exactly said they saw them in there. None of the store employees recognized crystal when she was found. If one of them confirmed that Mike and Diane where there in the morning then youd assume one of them would have said " hey thats the little girl that was with that couple earlier" when she was found there.
The press does get things wrong and I have not been able to find out who stated they saw them at that store.
If Diane's body was later dumped in Eble then how do we explain the truck?? Was the killer driving around in it until he deciced to dispose of her?
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:39 PM   #69
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You make the comment that someone would have recognized him. I would ask who?? His family? His friends? Who would recognize him and turn him in if he moved a thousand miles from where people knew him.
Well, you did just mention that his face was shown to a national audience. It's happened quite a number of times on UM. Someone recognizes a co-worker, a customer, a neighbor, or even a new spouse as an individual profiled on the program. As far as the picture quality is concerned, there have been cases in which viewers have recognized fugitives from only a few photographs. Recall James Donald King, for example. The photographs shown of him were years old and he was still captured. Maria Armstrong cropped her long dark hair and dyed it blonde, and was subsequently recognized nearly 2,000 miles away from Arizona. As they say, stranger things have happened.

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All it would take is one person willing to help Mike and keep their mouth shut for him to never be found.
Nah. I'm not of the opinion it's quite that simple. It's a lot of work to live on the lam. Consider new names, IDs, SSNs, stories to fabricate, physical appearances to alter. People to cooperate with your efforts. Plenty of people turn themselves in because it's simply just too tiring. That's not to say that it couldn't happen, of course, but I find it much less likely.

Quote:
With the serial killer theory we see that we have a killer who is murdering people and leaving bodies in plain sight. Not only that he has left a calling card so that people will know its him. Then it comes to Mike and we have no trace. For whatever reason he decides Mike body must be hidden away?? Seems strange to me that he would take the biggest heaviest body and move it somewhere.
Unless Mike was taken somewhere else and killed there, for whatever reason.

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The blood in the truck is also a tell tale sign to me. It either means that the altercation between Mike and Diane started in the truck or it means someone with blood on them got back in that truck after getting a victims blood on them.
It could mean literally anything given the very limited number of facts available to us in the segment. One could consider it supportive of the theory that Mike killed Diana, a serial killer killed them both, or a third known party perpetrated the crime(s?). I don't consider it very definitive.
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:39 PM   #70
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It was not mentioned in the segment at all. It was in a newspaper article well after Diane's body was found and I really don't know if there is any truth to it or who exactly said they saw them in there. None of the store employees recognized crystal when she was found. If one of them confirmed that Mike and Diane where there in the morning then youd assume one of them would have said " hey thats the little girl that was with that couple earlier" when she was found there.
The press does get things wrong and I have not been able to find out who stated they saw them at that store.
If Diane's body was later dumped in Eble then how do we explain the truck?? Was the killer driving around in it until he deciced to dispose of her?
It's highly unlikely (but still possible) that the truck was hidden with Diana's body somewhere and then moved to Elbe. But I personally think Diana was killed where she was found. If Riemer, Diana, and Crystal left the Tacoma area after checking his traps and then went to Elbe looking for a Christmas tree, isn't it possible that Riemer's body was just out in the open somewhere but never found? And after months/years his remains met fate with the elements? It took two months to find Diana's body (since everyone was searching within the area of Riemer's trap route), so what if Riemer was killed some distance away from Diana, and just never found? Ruth Cooper was only a mile away from Stephen Harkins and it took authorities two months to find her body. Or maybe this killer did plan to hide both bodies, killed Riemer first and then buried or hid his, but then Diana either put up an unexpected struggle or the killer did not anticipate Crystal being there, which is why Diana's body was left out in the open.

The reason law enforcement aren't pursuing Riemer with intensity is because there is a lack of evidence in this case that implicates him. Obviously if the type of knott used in both cases could be connected to trapping somehow, Riemer becomes your number one suspect. Or if through forensic evidence they determine that Riemer owned a similiar blade/knife used in Diana's murder again, he becomes your number one suspect and an intense manhunt would have followed. If Riemer was the clear prime suspect in this case, police would have put him on wanted posters, and they would have thoroughly looked for him. Law enforcement almost certainly looked at Riemer as the prime suspect (initially) after Diana's body was found, since Riemer was missing. They would not just throw their arms up in the air and say, "Oh well, maybe he's dead too." and stop looking. We say it all the time about LE having the most evidence and having first-hand knowledge of the case, and they obviously know more than what was presented in a UM segment. That said, I think there's more evidence pointing in the direction of a serial killer which is why Riemer is still classified as a missing person.
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Old 12-28-2010, 12:57 PM   #71
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It's highly unlikely (but still possible) that the truck was hidden with Diana's body somewhere and then moved to Elbe. But I personally think Diana was killed where she was found. If Riemer, Diana, and Crystal left the Tacoma area after checking his traps and then went to Elbe looking for a Christmas tree, isn't it possible that Riemer's body was just out in the open somewhere but never found? And after months/years his remains met fate with the elements? It took two months to find Diana's body (since everyone was searching within the area of Riemer's trap route), so what if Riemer was killed some distance away from Diana, and just never found? Ruth Cooper was only a mile away from Stephen Harkins and it took authorities two months to find her body. Or maybe this killer did plan to hide both bodies, killed Riemer first and then buried or hid his, but then Diana either put up an unexpected struggle or the killer did not anticipate Crystal being there, which is why Diana's body was left out in the open.

The reason law enforcement aren't pursuing Riemer with intensity is because there is a lack of evidence in this case that implicates him. Obviously if the type of knott used in both cases could be connected to trapping somehow, Riemer becomes your number one suspect. Or if through forensic evidence they determine that Riemer owned a similiar blade/knife used in Diana's murder again, he becomes your number one suspect and an intense manhunt would have followed. If Riemer was the clear prime suspect in this case, police would have put him on wanted posters, and they would have thoroughly looked for him. Law enforcement almost certainly looked at Riemer as the prime suspect (initially) after Diana's body was found, since Riemer was missing. They would not just throw their arms up in the air and say, "Oh well, maybe he's dead too." and stop looking. We say it all the time about LE having the most evidence and having first-hand knowledge of the case, and they obviously know more than what was presented in a UM segment. That said, I think there's more evidence pointing in the direction of a serial killer which is why Riemer is still classified as a missing person.
There is a lack of evidence that implicates him? That is not what the lead investigator said. He clearly said that there was enough evidence to issue a warrant for Mike's arrest if they could only prove he was alive.
I dont think they just threw their arms up and didnt look but if he leaves the area then what do they do? If the FBI wont get involved and he stays out of Pierrce county then how is he to be found? Keep in mind the segment aired three years later. That gave him plenty of time to establish a new life.
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Old 12-28-2010, 01:10 PM   #72
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There is a lack of evidence that implicates him? That is not what the lead investigator said. He clearly said that there was enough evidence to issue a warrant for Mike's arrest if they could only prove he was alive.
No. He said Mike immediately becomes a suspect. A world of difference.

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I dont think they just threw their arms up and didnt look but if he leaves the area then what do they do? If the FBI wont get involved and he stays out of Pierrce county then how is he to be found? Keep in mind the segment aired three years later. That gave him plenty of time to establish a new life.
1. Agencies are constantly in contact with other jurisdictions, and the notion of at least an area or regional APB certainly wasn't unheard of in 1985. There are plenty of ways Mike could've been found and brought back to Washington.

2. Again, I say: Plenty of people have established "new lives" and have been summarily caught, whether sooner or later. James Donald King (again), Margo Freshwater, Dennis Depue, Joe Sheppard, Joe Weldon Smith, Cheryl Holland, and Jim Burnside are all fine examples.
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Old 12-28-2010, 02:38 PM   #73
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No. He said Mike immediately becomes a suspect. A world of difference.



1. Agencies are constantly in contact with other jurisdictions, and the notion of at least an area or regional APB certainly wasn't unheard of in 1985. There are plenty of ways Mike could've been found and brought back to Washington.

2. Again, I say: Plenty of people have established "new lives" and have been summarily caught, whether sooner or later. James Donald King (again), Margo Freshwater, Dennis Depue, Joe Sheppard, Joe Weldon Smith, Cheryl Holland, and Jim Burnside are all fine examples.
No not a world of difference. He states that if Mike is alive then he is a suspect. I did make a mistake, it wasnt the officer but Stack who stated that there was enough evidence to charge Mike "if" they could find him alive.

Yes agencies are in contact with other jurisdictions and they could put out an area apb but consider this. Mike and Diane where not reported missing until that night. Other then child abandonement no one in LE could even confirm there was a crime comitted until Diane's body was found three months later. Also consider it was three days before anyone knew that Crystal was Mike and Daine's child. Not till they put her on TV did the grandmother come forward.

Im sure they suspected both where victims of foul play until just Diane was found. He had three months to get away and is not on any FBI wanted list so what more needs to be said?? Mike could live off the land and was skilled in a job that usually pays in cash and is fairly anonymous. Again this is why illegal immigrants flock to roofing companies. Also it was a hell of alot easier to establish a new identity in 1985 then now. There where plenty of books on the subject back then. The paper trail is one that comes to mind.

I understand that plenty of people have tried to establish a new life only to be caught but would you agree that there are plenty that where never seen or heard from again?? Of the people you listed, how many where classified as missing/endagered and how many where fugitives?? How many of them had a 50/50 chance that they where murdered and their body was hidden? How many had three months to run before anyone knew they may have comitted a crime?? How many did not have a recent photo of them posted on the segment?
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Old 12-28-2010, 02:53 PM   #74
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No not a world of difference. He states that if Mike is alive then he is a suspect.
I'm sorry, but I do say it is quite different to be considered a suspect than to be arrested or indicted for a crime.

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I did make a mistake, it wasnt the officer but Stack who stated that there was enough evidence to charge Mike "if" they could find him alive.
Provided, of course, that the evidence works against Mike. That has to occur first, and I suspect the authorities may have been waiting on Mike's testimony on his version of events in order to make that happen, if it could happen. I would say that this is probably the reason why he wasn't labeled a fugitive, and is officially listed as a missing person: the evidence is probably insubstantial, and all legal actions are contingent on what Mike provides in questioning. It has to work.

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How many of them had a 50/50 chance that they where murdered and their body was hidden?
Well, all of them. Perhaps with better or worse odds. There's no way of ascertaining that probability.
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Old 12-28-2010, 03:57 PM   #75
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I'm sorry, but I do say it is quite different to be considered a suspect than to be arrested or indicted for a crime.



Provided, of course, that the evidence works against Mike. That has to occur first, and I suspect the authorities may have been waiting on Mike's testimony on his version of events in order to make that happen, if it could happen. I would say that this is probably the reason why he wasn't labeled a fugitive, and is officially listed as a missing person: the evidence is probably insubstantial, and all legal actions are contingent on what Mike provides in questioning. It has to work.



Well, all of them. Perhaps with better or worse odds. There's no way of ascertaining that probability.
Here is just the evidence we have from the segment.........

Mike was the last known person to be with the murdered subject.

Mike had a history of violence against this person


Diane had gotten a restraining order against Mike because of Domestic violence.

Diane's mother states that Mike had told Diane he could kill her and get away with it.

Diane's best friend stated that Mike beat her up often.

Diane's body was found next to Mike's truck in an area Mike was very familiar with and had been trapping animals in since childhood.

Mike's child was left in an area where she would be safe after her mother was brutally murdered..

There where two prior killings in a secluded area that Mike was known to frequent. One of the people killed had the same calling card (tube sock tied around neck) that Diane had.

Mike's remains where never found though the other people killed where left where the killer knew they would be discovered.

No LE had any idea that a crime had been comitted in this case until a body was found three months later. There was no manhunt for Mike right off the bat because he was considered missing just like Diane until she was found. This gave him ample time to get away.

We can speculate about alot of things here but what I have listed are cold hard facts. What do we have that shows he was the victim of a random serial killer??
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