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Old 08-30-2011, 03:28 PM   #76
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That's how our Society views things. "It's none of my business." "Just ignore it." augh... it's no wonder people end up getting murdered or in abusive relationships. :/ it makes me sick.
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Old 08-30-2011, 11:24 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NellieBlyArmy
I was thinking about this, and I think casual misogyny is so common that yeah, he could probably get away with it. I work in a DV shelter and I can assure you, the men who beat these women are generally pretty popular guys. I've seen women's own mothers side with the abuser. I've seen whole communities come together to hide the abuser so he can't get served with a restraining order. Think that town in Texas who called that 11 year old girl who got gang-raped a "slut" and cried police injustice when the rapists got arrested. I bet pretty much anyone can think of some really awful stuff men they know have done to or said about women, guys you may otherwise like. The sheer number of rape jokes or "just get her drunk" jokes many people make is staggering.

Thinking in my own life, I know a guy who heard his ex (a next door neighbor) getting beaten by her current boyfriend and told the story like it was a joke, a guy who thinks "ugly" women should be grateful for sexual harassment who also broke into his ex's apartment to steal back a present he bought her 8 months before they broke up, and a guy who held a female friend of mine against a wall because she turned him down for a date. I can think of plenty of other stuff, but it would turn into a novel. These guys all have friends, long-term relationships, etc. They're not piriahs or considered generally "bad," just guys who maybe get carried away, or were hurt by a woman and therefore bitter so it makes sense that they'd be that angry. Hell, just look at this thread - there is a ton of "He's probably raping ladies because some woman made fun of his wang when he was young," which is so ridiculous as to not be funny. I mean, obviously being mocked doesn't actually turn you into a serial rapist (even if it is a woman who does the mocking) but an actual cop is floating that theory.

Seeing this type of behavior makes people uncomfortable, yeah, but we're all pretty well socialized not to rock the boat and to give people the benefit of the doubt. Misogynists, racists, homophobes - they get away with a TON in day-to-day life when you think about it. So yeah, I have no doubt that his hatred of women won't prevent him from having friends and lovers, and I am positive that alone wouldn't inspire someone to suggest his name to the cops.
IMO, 'misogynist' doesn't even describe the East Area Rapist. He was a full blown woman hater to the extreme. The amount of women he raped is simply sickening. I have a hard time believing this nutjob could even ask a woman out on a date. Though, he's probably seems normal to his guy friends.

If he ever did have a girlfriend or wife, I would think they would take notice of his strange behavior towards women.
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Old 08-30-2011, 11:54 PM   #78
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I agree with you NellieBlyArmy. I just want to clarify, though, that when I mentioned the theory that he may have started this behavior because of his small penis, I meant it seriously. I think being mocked by women (or even other men, such as in a locker room situation) perhaps caused a great seed of anger and rage, and the desire to hurt and be dominant. But I also believe this- if it is true- would not have been the only reason.
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:05 AM   #79
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I just want to clarify, though, that when I mentioned the theory that he may have started this behavior because of his small penis, I meant it seriously. I think being mocked by women (or even other men, such as in a locker room situation) perhaps caused a great seed of anger and rage, and the desire to hurt and be dominant. But I also believe this- if it is true- would not have been the only reason.
For the record, your post didn't bug me. I was more squicked by Zlatko's description of some investigators' theory (not Zlatko personally) - that a specific girl laughed at him during a sexual encounter and that set him off. Sorry I wasn't all that clear about that.

That said, I do agree that he could have issues with his penis (it sounds pretty indisputable that it was small), and I appreciate you adding that it could've been a locker room situation. The idea that he was massively insecure about his worth as a man, attached that to penis size, and decided to use violence to feel better makes sense to me.

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Old 08-31-2011, 11:47 AM   #80
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I didn't think about it until now but it's worth pointing out that penis size is much more of a male obsession. What I mean to say is I doubt penis size is a topic of discussion for women. Men, on the other hand, tend to obsess over it. So, it seems less likely that a woman would point out his inadequacy. Though, it could be possible.

I think it's worth exploring if EAR had mother issues or something. Maybe he had a domineering mother and a father who didn't care for him.
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Old 08-31-2011, 12:21 PM   #81
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I posted this in another thread before seeing this one, but perhaps this is a more appropriate location:

So I was watching Dateline last Friday on the case of Gary Hilton. I noticed his piercing blue eyes at one point, and one of his older pictures showed pretty beefy thighs/legs for a shorter man like him. Any idea where Gary Hilton was in the 1970s and 1980s? Because he seems like a potential fit for the Original Night Stalker. The Dateline segment said he was 61, but spoke almost nothing of what Hilton was up to prior to working on a film circa 1995. The only reference they made was that Hilton was a conman who posed as raising funds for charities from 1973-1993 when he actually just pocketed any contributions he received.
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Old 08-31-2011, 04:30 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DolfanBlitz
I posted this in another thread before seeing this one, but perhaps this is a more appropriate location:

So I was watching Dateline last Friday on the case of Gary Hilton. I noticed his piercing blue eyes at one point, and one of his older pictures showed pretty beefy thighs/legs for a shorter man like him. Any idea where Gary Hilton was in the 1970s and 1980s? Because he seems like a potential fit for the Original Night Stalker. The Dateline segment said he was 61, but spoke almost nothing of what Hilton was up to prior to working on a film circa 1995. The only reference they made was that Hilton was a conman who posed as raising funds for charities from 1973-1993 when he actually just pocketed any contributions he received.
You may have to elaborate with a little more information to make a case for what makes you think its this guy. Con men are typically far different psychologically from serial killers and rapists.
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Old 08-31-2011, 04:32 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zlatko
I didn't think about it until now but it's worth pointing out that penis size is much more of a male obsession. What I mean to say is I doubt penis size is a topic of discussion for women. Men, on the other hand, tend to obsess over it. So, it seems less likely that a woman would point out his inadequacy. Though, it could be possible.

I think it's worth exploring if EAR had mother issues or something. Maybe he had a domineering mother and a father who didn't care for him.
I don't think its as prevalent, but there are very superficial women out there.
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Old 08-31-2011, 11:47 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NellieBlyArmy
I was thinking about this, and I think casual misogyny is so common that yeah, he could probably get away with it. I work in a DV shelter and I can assure you, the men who beat these women are generally pretty popular guys. I've seen women's own mothers side with the abuser. I've seen whole communities come together to hide the abuser so he can't get served with a restraining order. Think that town in Texas who called that 11 year old girl who got gang-raped a "slut" and cried police injustice when the rapists got arrested. I bet pretty much anyone can think of some really awful stuff men they know have done to or said about women, guys you may otherwise like. The sheer number of rape jokes or "just get her drunk" jokes many people make is staggering.

Thinking in my own life, I know a guy who heard his ex (a next door neighbor) getting beaten by her current boyfriend and told the story like it was a joke, a guy who thinks "ugly" women should be grateful for sexual harassment who also broke into his ex's apartment to steal back a present he bought her 8 months before they broke up, and a guy who held a female friend of mine against a wall because she turned him down for a date. I can think of plenty of other stuff, but it would turn into a novel. These guys all have friends, long-term relationships, etc. They're not piriahs or considered generally "bad," just guys who maybe get carried away, or were hurt by a woman and therefore bitter so it makes sense that they'd be that angry. Hell, just look at this thread - there is a ton of "He's probably raping ladies because some woman made fun of his wang when he was young," which is so ridiculous as to not be funny. I mean, obviously being mocked doesn't actually turn you into a serial rapist (even if it is a woman who does the mocking) but an actual cop is floating that theory.

Seeing this type of behavior makes people uncomfortable, yeah, but we're all pretty well socialized not to rock the boat and to give people the benefit of the doubt. Misogynists, racists, homophobes - they get away with a TON in day-to-day life when you think about it. So yeah, I have no doubt that his hatred of women won't prevent him from having friends and lovers, and I am positive that alone wouldn't inspire someone to suggest his name to the cops.
Great post. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zlatko
I didn't think about it until now but it's worth pointing out that penis size is much more of a male obsession. What I mean to say is I doubt penis size is a topic of discussion for women. Men, on the other hand, tend to obsess over it. So, it seems less likely that a woman would point out his inadequacy. Though, it could be possible.

I think it's worth exploring if EAR had mother issues or something. Maybe he had a domineering mother and a father who didn't care for him.
Women may talk about it a little amongst themselves, but I'd be afraid I would be beaten or killed if I ever criticized a man's "size" to his face. I'm not exaggerating here. I think men tend to forget how truly vulnerable women are. I think this an overly simplistic explanation.

Also, the "domineering mother" thing is considered passe...not really something experts take seriously anymore, although it kinda hangs around as a theory. It's been used to explain everything from serial killers to homosexuality. It's one of those things where psychologists in the 1950s and 60s tended to blame everything on the mother. Well, psychology is an evolving field, and they got a lot wrong back then. Another overly simplistic explanation.
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Old 09-01-2011, 09:53 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Orange_Sody_84
That's how our Society views things. "It's none of my business." "Just ignore it." augh... it's no wonder people end up getting murdered or in abusive relationships. :/ it makes me sick.
I think you are generalizing a bit. Not everyone in our society views it that way.

But in defense of those who do, I think there are some things to keep in mind. Many times women who are victims of domestic violence often bring some of it on themselves, by refusing to go to the police themselves or even defending their partner's actions, or lying for them.

So reporting actions of domestic violence can sometimes be tricky. Cause you never really know how an abused female is going to treat the situation, its entirely possible if you do report such a thing the victim may turn on you in defense of their partner. As sickening as that is it does happen.

The important thing to remember is, there is help out there for abused women, but ultimately its up to them to seek it. Because for those who refuse and want to tolerate these scumbags in their life, there is really only so much you can do, unless they are caught in the act by law enforcement. You might report something, the wife may deny the whole thing then all of the sudden you and YOUR credibility are attacked.

Now rape on the other hand, there is absoloutely no excuse to ignore that. But you have to be careful to if you witness it and make sure what you are witnessing is rape and not some form of kinky sex, or that can get you in trouble as well. Because there is little way of distorting rape, an unwilling sexual partner is an unwilling sexual partner.
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Old 09-01-2011, 08:36 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nohwheregirl



Women may talk about it a little amongst themselves, but I'd be afraid I would be beaten or killed if I ever criticized a man's "size" to his face. I'm not exaggerating here. I think men tend to forget how truly vulnerable women are. I think this an overly simplistic explanation.

Also, the "domineering mother" thing is considered passe...not really something experts take seriously anymore, although it kinda hangs around as a theory. It's been used to explain everything from serial killers to homosexuality. It's one of those things where psychologists in the 1950s and 60s tended to blame everything on the mother. Well, psychology is an evolving field, and they got a lot wrong back then. Another overly simplistic explanation.
Well, if a woman really wanted to shatter a man's self image, making fun of his unit would be the easiest way to do so. Strange as it may sound, men are often conscious of that part of their body as women can be conscious about their looks. Like I said, a lot of men obsess over it. It's possible the EAR was made aware of his 'inadequacy' by males as well. Sexual domination over women possibly made him feel more masculine, as warped as it may sound.

I don't think we could rule out the idea he had a domineering mother. But it's also possible he was rejected all together by both parents. Regardless, I think the EAR had at least one parent who wasn't exactly loving towards him.

Last edited by Zlatko; 09-02-2011 at 12:47 AM.
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Old 09-01-2011, 11:11 PM   #87
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Oh, ok NellieBly, just wanted to be sure

I'm really sorry to hear of these things you've witnessed. It's sad that such behavior is so prevalent in our society. I haven't seen anything that extreme, but I've heard plenty of "just get her drunk" type of jokes that are NOT ok in my opinion. Or people who treat assault as something to make humor out of. Not cool.

So I do totally understand that this guy could be married and even if he is openly misogynistic in the ways you've described, hard to track down. It's just frightening to think about, but a very open possibility.

As a female I can't speak personally over phallic consciousness, but I understand the connection you're making to females being self-conscious about their looks, Zlatko. Sometimes parts of our bodies can make us ashamed or overly worried about others' opinions. If he was provoked by taunting, then it would be even more likely to lead to anger. If a woman taunted him or he was rejected by multiple women, perhaps that's why he decided to exercise force, a way to gain domination, and control. If any males taunted him, he certainly inflicted enough pain on men alone by torturing them with the plates trick and assaulting their wives and girlfriends. Maybe I'm going to far with the phallic angle, but I think he was definitely either taunted for that or simply rejected by others.

And I especially like the idea of parental issues being thrown out there. It seems very possible.
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:08 PM   #88
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EAR-ONS took a three-toed dog (known as 'Woofy') with him to a few of the crime scenes.

A local hoodlum called Brett Glasby apparently also used 'Woofy' as a guard dog when he went to raid marijuana 'farms'.

One of EAR-ONS' victims was a Dr. Offerman.

Glasby was a patient of Offerman, and was convicted of a serious violent assault on Dr. Offerman's janitor.

Glasby was 'killed' in Mexico in 1982 (so couldn't have been EAR-ONS who was still murdering in 1986) although I would like to see Glasby's 'death' officially confirmed, as the circumstances surrounding it are somewhat mysterious...

I am fairly convinced that Glasby and EAR-ONS knew each other (or at least knew of each other) due to the 'Woofy' and Offerman links.

The three-toed dog lead (pardon the pun!) has IMHO never been fully examined.

There are other aspects of the crimes involving the dog which lead me to suspect that EAR-ONS possibly had family living in Goleta.
Found on a different forum
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Old 09-24-2012, 12:04 PM   #89
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I think you are generalizing a bit. Not everyone in our society views it that way.

But in defense of those who do, I think there are some things to keep in mind. Many times women who are victims of domestic violence often bring some of it on themselves, by refusing to go to the police themselves or even defending their partner's actions, or lying for them.

So reporting actions of domestic violence can sometimes be tricky. Cause you never really know how an abused female is going to treat the situation, its entirely possible if you do report such a thing the victim may turn on you in defense of their partner. As sickening as that is it does happen.

The important thing to remember is, there is help out there for abused women, but ultimately its up to them to seek it.

Recently, I just learned this first hand and it was quite shocking to me. I started seeing a former coworker socially and found out half way through that she was still in a relationship with her abusive boyfriend. Not long after hearing this he beat her up. She told me and I just asked her is that is what she wanted. She said she didn't know. A few days later she justified the beating as being ok due to they were both blackout drunk. My heart sank right then and there because I knew 1, she would never leave him and 2, it would probably end up killing her and she was fine with that.

It's terrible to see these women get stuck in a fear cycle where they are too afraid to say anything or even women rationiszing that they on some level deserve it. It's sickening.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:16 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XCalibur
I think you are generalizing a bit. Not everyone in our society views it that way.

But in defense of those who do, I think there are some things to keep in mind. Many times women who are victims of domestic violence often bring some of it on themselves, by refusing to go to the police themselves or even defending their partner's actions, or lying for them.

So reporting actions of domestic violence can sometimes be tricky. Cause you never really know how an abused female is going to treat the situation, its entirely possible if you do report such a thing the victim may turn on you in defense of their partner. As sickening as that is it does happen.

The important thing to remember is, there is help out there for abused women, but ultimately its up to them to seek it. Because for those who refuse and want to tolerate these scumbags in their life, there is really only so much you can do, unless they are caught in the act by law enforcement. You might report something, the wife may deny the whole thing then all of the sudden you and YOUR credibility are attacked.

Now rape on the other hand, there is absoloutely no excuse to ignore that. But you have to be careful to if you witness it and make sure what you are witnessing is rape and not some form of kinky sex, or that can get you in trouble as well. Because there is little way of distorting rape, an unwilling sexual partner is an unwilling sexual partner.
OT but I think it's important to avoid any sort of victim blame. For outsiders, it's easy for anyone to say, "Oh, why doesn't she just call the authorities?" However, people in abusive relationships are often simply too frightened to go to the authorities. The abuser may have beaten them down, emotionally and physically, to the point that they feel helpless. The abuser may even threaten the victim's loved ones. (mother, father, etc.) I tend to think that the abusive lover feels the need for power over their victim.

It would not surprise me if the original night stalker was an abusive individual.
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