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Old 10-24-2010, 05:31 AM   #136
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I'm pretty sure it's him. He spells his name in an odd way, and the pic he had as his profile pic a few days ago was a dead ringer for his father.
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Old 10-24-2010, 09:01 AM   #137
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Regarding some earlier posts a few pages back - I agree that as much of a crotchety, insensitive old grouch that Ida Pruitt comes across as, I don't think she had an active part in the (probable) murders. That's not to say she didn't have some knowledge of what they were planning to do, though.

I'll have to rewatch the segment, but I know one point they were discussing was that given the timeline, it would've been impossible to make the trip they were planning (i.e. to return Wendy, Lisa and Cynthia back home, then for Beverly to meet Chad back closer to home) which I agree with.

What's the last time Wendy was 100% confirmed alive? I never thought of the idea of someone impersonating her and/or a gun being at her head at that moment, but it's possible. Not that Leon would remember exactly all these years later, but I'm sure if there was any distress in her voice, he would've picked up on it and asked if everything was ok, etc.

I don't buy the Walmart story, they probably were never there in the first place, although most likely it's in the area with whatever happened to them, so they probably used it as a diversion.

P.S. It's so weird to hear Walmart mentioned in that context, because it so doesn't seem like an 80s place (though I believe it was around in the Midwest before it caught on elsewhere). The first one I went to was built in '93 or 94 and back then it was like a total novelty (even in a metro area, lol). It didn't even become global (like the way McDonald's is) until the early-mid 2000s.
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Old 10-24-2010, 11:47 AM   #138
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In some ways, I think this case is like the abducted Baskin kids. Chad Noe got custody of the son he had with Wendy (but then it appears he didn't really bother raising him and handed the child off to others.)

Since the boy was so young when his mother went missing, and the fact that he was subsequently raised by people who seemed to hate Wendy, isn't it possible that, like the Baskin kids, he's been taught lies or negative things about Wendy that would make him not have any interest in finding the biological mother who "abandoned" him, or even reading about her side of the story?

I wonder if he even knows that Wendy, her daughter, and her sister in law went missing on the very day that Wendy was to finally have a visitation with him? He was so young, he could have been told any kind of story about when/where she went missing. However, if I were in this young man's situation, the coincidence of the timing of the disappearances would definitely make me want to know more about a possible connection to a deadly family feud.
Actually, looking back at the earlier threads, this is what Wendy Camp's sister had to say about Jonathan today:

"Johnathan has a really bad learning disability, he has NO co-ordination, and he is sweet as can be, but just not really "there" like you would expect."

So I guess he may not have inherited his family's evil and mean-spirited side, but I'm sure being raised in that environment has had a lot of negative effects on him.
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Old 10-24-2010, 12:07 PM   #139
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Here is what I find odd about this case: on the one hand, as some have suggested, looked at one way, it can seem like this was all part of a meticulous plot to kill Wendy Camp from the beginning. After months of objecting to visits from Wendy, suddenly Chad calls up and says not only can you visit, but I'll send my mother out to get you. Strange.

On the other hand, if this was a plan, it was a bad plan. First of all, simply by sending a car out to get her, Chad Noe and family have established, beyod a shadow of a doubt, who she was with in the hours leading up to her disappearance. If she doesn't come back from this little trip, suspiscion will immediately fall upon Chad and his family - if the intent all along was to kill Wendy, why make it so obvious?

And why let Wendy call when she gets there, and call again when she leaves? It could be that both calls were hoaxes, that someone among Chad's family/inner circle was capable of immitating Wendy's voice that completely, but... c'mon. That is more of a movie plot point than something that can be so easily carried off in real life (I can see Chad's mother putting a napking over the talk-piece of the phone right now, and - voila! - magically she sounds just like Wendy). And, apparently, Wendy called not only her husband, but her Mom, at 4:45 when she was leaving, so it makes this voice imitation theory even less likely.

What all this tells me is that Hambone, in his post above, is decidedly correct: Chad and his family let Wendy visit with Jonathan that day. Which further suggests to me that if Chad, et. al, did murder Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee, that was not the original intent of the day. Why bring her out, have her visit, then kill her? I suppose you might say, "To let Jonathan see her one last time," but man, that is cold-blooded. More, if the plan was to murder Wendy all along, why didn't Beverly, Chad's Mom, object or try to stop Wendy from bringing Cynthia, or talk Renee, Leon's sister, out of coming? If Chad's plan was to murder Wendy all along, I would wager his mother didn't know about it - otherwise, she would have tried to reduce the number of people going along with Wendy that day. The segment tells us that Renee going was Leon's idea, and was cooked up between the time Chad called Wendy that morning and invited her to see Jonathan and the time Beverly arrived to pick Wendy up. So, there is no way Chad and company could have known, prior to Beverly's arrival, that Leon's sister was coming along for the trip. Further, I wonder if they knew or realized that Wendy would bring her daughter - her 6 year old daughter - with her to visit her son. I can't imagine it was part of the plan to kill a 6 year old child as part of this plot.

No, it seems to me that the decision to kill Wendy must have come some time during this trip, not as part of a plan from the very beginning. The question, of course, is when would that have occurred? And what could have turned things so sour during this three-hour visit to cause Chad et. al. to decide to murder these three?

A fair question at this point also is: what was the motive for these killings? Chad had custody of the child, and had demonstrated previously an ability to avoid visitations from Wendy. Triple homicide seems like a drastic an unnecessary step for him.

If Wendy's call back to her husband was genuine, which I believe it was, then she must have been murdered out on the road somewhere. What makes this all the more perplexing is that, assuming Wendy's call was genuine, Chad wasn't in the car with Wendy, Cynthia, Renee, or his mother as they left Chad's town that day. Isn't that strange? I suppose the murders might have happened within moments of Wendy hanging up the phone with her husband/mother, but again, that is awfully risky - it would make it far too obvious what had happened to her and her companions. The whole episode suggests to me that Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee did inded get into Beverly's car, probably with Ida, and they did indeed start driving off together.

This means that Chad had to take a separate car either to follow his mother or to meet her at some pre-arranged kill/dump site. That seems awfully pre-meditated, and yet much of the rest of what transpired that day seems quite the opposite of pre-meditated. Perhaps Wendy et. al. were drugged in the car, and once they were all asleep, Beverly met Chad at some pre-arranged meeting spot out in the backwoods somewhere, where Wendy, Renee, and Cynthia were then killed and buried?

Sorry this post is rambling and disorganized, but what I am leading to is something rather shocking: I don't think the case against Chad is as open and shut as people seem to think it is. I know Chad seems like an awful fellow in the segment. I know the Wal-Mart story simply doesn't add up. I know there is essentially no likelihood these three disappeared together on their own. That seems to leave only one possibility: Chad and his mom, at the very least, murdered these three.

But there seem to me to be significant questions concerning Chad's motive for these killings (killing three people, just to avoid occasional visitations, which he had already demonstrated a skill for avoiding?), his "plan" for doing them (when exactly was it decided that the three must die? Seems not to have been part of the original plan, but, if it was, why make it so obvious to everyone where Wendy et. al. were and who they were with just prior to their disappearances?), his opporunity for doing them (if their plan was to kill her, why on earth would they let Wendy call her husband to tell him she was on her way home? Doesn't make any sense), and, in particular, the nuts and bolts of how these murders were carried out (Chad met his mother somewhere secluded and the two of them killed the three of them there? They were killed before they ever left town? If so, must have happened shortly after Wendy's phone call - but that seems unlikely; and who not only decides to murder a completely innocent 6 year old girl over a custody battle, but enlists his own mother for assistance in doing so?).

I don't like him either, and it would hardly surprise me if Chad did kill the three of them. But honestly, there is a lot here that is weird.
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Old 10-24-2010, 12:53 PM   #140
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That makes a lot of sense. It does seem weird that they would commit a triple homicide just to avoid the possibility of future visitations with the child.

I don't think the Walmart thing ever happened. On Websleuths, and maybe here too, Wendy's sister said that the Oklahoma authorities (I think the OFBI) have the details of Wendy's last call. It originated somewhere on the opposite side of the expressway than where the WM is located.

If the murders were premeditated, I wonder if maybe the group had conspired to kill Wendy, but then at the last minute, she brought along two other people, one of them being a child, which threw them off their plan. They may have permitted the visit to take place while they discussed whether or not to go ahead and kill Wendy, with the sister in law and little girl being sort of collateral damage.

On the other hand, I can definitely see that ridiculous bunch getting in a argument and just committing murders on the spur of the moment.

Whatever happened, I'm sure that Wendy is dead. Her sister said that she was on medication that she had to take regularly to survive. She could only live two or three days without it. I don't know what it was or what ailment it treated, but Wendy didn't bring the medicine with her that day, indicating that she didn't intend to be away from home any longer than her visit would take.
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Old 10-24-2010, 01:05 PM   #141
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Excellent points, Mozartpc. You're definitely right that Wendy was the target and they would have no way of knowing about Cynthia or Renee (my bad, I forgot her name since I haven't watch the seg in awhile).

I agree that even for the type of people they are, that does seem uncharacteristic and an awful lot of a length to go through, just for a custody battle that Chad was on the winning end of. Maybe there was some argument during the visitation and it was a spur of the moment thing? Even with as much of an old witch (using the most polite word there, lmao) that Ida was, I'm not sure she's quite capable of murder...and I'm sure at least Renee could've physically defended herself against her, unless of course she had a weapon.

If Beverly and Chad (the most likely suspects) did anything to Renee and Cynthia, it would've probably just been because they were witnesses. I get the feeling Ida was correct about her version of events, that they started arguing in the car and something enraged Beverly enough to decide to do away with them. Even for white trash like them, that seems awfully like an overreaction, but of course I wouldn't put it past them, especially Chad. If that indeed is the case, then ironically Ida asking to be dropped off may have made the situation worse. They might've not gone through with it if she was around. Again, she may have been a cranky, heartless, unpleasant old bag, but I don't see her as being an active participant in the murders, especially to an innocent little kid.

That would also explain the phone calls, which more than likely were genuine and of her own free will, assuming everything was ok. Especially if Wendy also called her mom, which (a) I'm sure if there was a gun pointed at her, they wouldn't have let her make, and (b) wouldn't have thought of it on their own to have Wendy call her.

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Old 10-24-2010, 03:39 PM   #142
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The whole thing reminds me of the Sammy Wheeler case, actually. Lots of bitterness on all sides, lots of accustaions and counter-accusations, but in the end Wheeler was murdered by some stranger.

The problem with this case is that most of Chad Noe's story is believable, and seems vaguely supported by Wendy's telephone calls, up until 4:45. It could be that Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee were murdered shortly after that time, but in the segment they show Wendy finishing up the call with her husband by saying, "I have to go, Beverly is waiting" or something to that effect. I guess my problem is this: if Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee got into a car with Beverly and Ida, but NOT Chad Noe, as Ida and Chad claimed, the murder plot gets pretty complicated pretty fast. Of course, murder may well still have happened, and Ida or Chad or both could certainly be lying, but again, something doesn't seem quite right.

It would be nice to know where and when Chad and Beverly were next seen after the 4:45 phone calls by Wendy to her husband and mother.

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Old 10-24-2010, 05:03 PM   #143
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Looking back through this thread, the poster who had registered here claiming* to be Wendy's sister mentioned that Chad didn't really raise Jonathan, but rather left Jonathan off with Beverly to be raised by her; worse, Chad supposedly visited Jonathan a grand total of ONCE following Wendy's disappearance, and, by the time Jonathan was 18 years old, he hadn't seen his father in 10 years.

Assuming this account is even sort of true, it suggests Chad was, at best, a distracted father. Meanwhile, the poster claiming to be Wendy's sister also suggested that Beverly and her mother, Ida, had been involved in some HEAVY stuff, including running an interstate underage prostitution ring. Nonetheless, she was also apparently Jonathan's primary caregiver after Chad won custody.

All this leads me to wonder: who had the greater stake in seeing Jonathan continue to reside with Chad and his family? Chad, the guy who seemed to be only vaguely interested in raising a son in the first place, or Beverly? Would Chad kill three people just to keep a kid he seemed only barely interested in anyway?

Perhaps it was Beverly, and not Chad, who orchestrated this whole thing. She appears to have been more of the criminal mastermind sort (and I use the term "mastermind" very loosely); Chad just seems to have been an all-around screw up.

*- I say the poster "claiming" to be Wendy's sister because I always take such claims on the internet, where people can claim to be whomever they like, with a grain of salt. I am never 100% convinced that a poster who comes on here saying they knew so-and-so or are so-and-so is being completely forthright. That said, the poster who claimed to be Wendy's sister did seem to be knowledgable and genuine.
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Old 10-26-2010, 10:18 AM   #144
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I don't think anyone on here thinks Chad was any mastermind at all. He was a moron who did what his mother told him to do. I agree that it was his mother's idea, but I think Chad carried out the plan.
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Old 10-27-2010, 10:24 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JenniferS.
Seems to me thr bones found were that of some male hikers or local guys. thought i read that some time ago online.

I read that somewhere, too, and now I can't find it back!
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Old 11-13-2010, 06:51 PM   #146
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I have friend that lives in the Shamrock, OK area where Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar went missing after making a trip to Shamrock from OKC to visit Wendy's son. Bones were found in a pond located on private property in the Drumright/Shamrock area. Bones are those thought to be Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar. An investigation is under way to determine more information as to what happened. It has been rumored that Chad Noe killed them and placed them in pond and had help.
I don't think Chad Noe acted alone. I believe Beverly who is Chad's mom and Jonathan's grandma was involved. I saw it on the internet that Beverly was arrested for arson.She could have helped bury the bodies or something. Beverly and Chad are not classy people. I think they planned to murder them before they even called to ask Wendy to visit because in the past they had moved, changed their numbers and did all that to sabotage visits and then all the sudden the day of the disappearance no sabotage, seems fishy to me. I believe what you say about the bones being found believed to be Wendy's.
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Old 11-13-2010, 07:34 PM   #147
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I will start off by saying that IMO Chad is guilty. Hands down, no question. Hang the SOB.

But...

The one thing that I have never really understood about this case is what is the motive? I am sure that given the circumstances there was no insurance policies still in place. Wendy and Chad were no longer related. Chad had full custody of Jonathan and the segment of UM gave no indication that that was going to change at any time. Also if custody were the issue, and Chad killed them because he wanted to make sure he kept his son, then why hasn't he seen much of him since then? If info on this thread is accurate, he hasn't seen much of Jonathan since this happened.

Like I said, I firmly believe that Chad killed the three, but why? It just doesn't make a lot of sense. What was to gain?
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Old 11-13-2010, 07:37 PM   #148
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PS

My question of motive of course comes with the assumption that the act was premeditated. Which it is likely to have been, hence the sudden "change of heart" by Chad calling and offering to let Wendy see Jonathan that day.

If they got in an argument during the visit or something, then obviously I could see him killing her in "one of his drunken stupers..."
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Old 12-20-2010, 01:59 PM   #149
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Keep in mind that Chad is the same guy that when his wife became very ill and was hospitalized had the reaction of divorcing her. Great guy huh? I wouldnt put anything past him.
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:32 PM   #150
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I'm surprised that given such obvious suspects, such an unbelievable narrative from those suspects and given the wealth of evidence that would have been available from the sister's car, that even the Oklahoma police fouled up this case as badly as they have.

The fact that no on saw them alive after they left the house should have been enough for warrant to search the Noe home and the car that they were last seen in. The past history of antagonism and Chad Noe's failure to follow the court-ordered visitation schedule should have been enough hold in him in custody until this matter was sorted out.

The police in this case bungled this from "Go" and have been unable to recover their stride in the time period since then. This case should be taught at police academies as an example of how NOT to investigate a multiple homicide.
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