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Old 04-24-2018, 08:11 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCars1986
From everything I'm reading, the police did not see or find the polaroid photos, it's just that they've heard people talk about seeing them. I don't want to sound like a pessimist, but it kind of reminds me of the Ellender case where the "witnesses" claim to have seen a video tape of the murder (which never surfaced). I'm also confused as to why the alleged motive for the crime was the 2 girls simply walking in on their parents buying drugs. That motive just doesn't make any sense.
Murder doesn't have to be logical. Especially with drugs involved.
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Old 04-24-2018, 08:36 AM   #62
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Quote:
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Murder doesn't have to be logical. Especially with drugs involved.
A drug debt being owed makes much more sense than killing the parents with a shotgun and torching the trailer just because the 2 girls walked in on a drug deal.
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Old 04-24-2018, 08:39 AM   #63
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A drug debt being owed makes much more sense than killing the parents with a shotgun and torching the trailer just because the 2 girls walked in on a drug deal.
I definitely agree on that.
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Old 04-24-2018, 09:01 AM   #64
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FYI, this article contains a link to the 30-page affidavit for Busick's arrest warrant and goes into more detail about what allegedly happened:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagela...3ee3e928a.html
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Old 04-24-2018, 09:28 AM   #65
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The Bibles kept the family Christmas tree up so Lauria could take it down when she got home. Lorene Bible said the tree fell apart in 2006.

These poor people.
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Old 04-24-2018, 10:09 AM   #66
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These poor people.
I was just reading that and thinking the exact same thing
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Old 04-24-2018, 10:34 AM   #67
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I'm glad the families are finally going to get some closure. But officially knowing the hell the girls went through during those multiple days before they were killed has to just add a whole slew of terror they'll never be able to get out of their heads.

These men are the lowest of low. On top of all the unspeakable things they did to Ashley and Lauria, to refer to them as 'the two b*tches' several years later and hang their missing person poster up as a badge of honor is so over the top evil, it kills me that they were able to remain free for as long as they did.

And for the men to say "if they wouldnít have taken off running, they would still be alive," is such a load of crap. On top of the victim blaming, are we really supposed to believe that had the girls just stood still after the parents were shot that the men would have made no effort to rape and kill them?
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:04 AM   #68
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And for the men to say "if they wouldnít have taken off running, they would still be alive," is such a load of crap. On top of the victim blaming, are we really supposed to believe that had the girls just stood still after the parents were shot that the men would have made no effort to rape and kill them?
Exactly. At "best," they would've killed them there, instead of kidnapping them. But chances are, unless the girls would not have been there, that night, the exact same thing that DID happen to them is what would've happened.
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:28 AM   #69
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I read the affidavit in its entirety.

I absolutely think that what is being proposed is what happened to these poor girls. I believe the Polaroids existed at one point, although they are gone now.

Proving the case against this guy, however, is going to be a bugger. I have never read an affidavit with so much hearsay in my life. I'm frankly struggling to see how the State is going to be able to prove the case against the Defendant. Sure, they have enough to charge him, but we all know the rules change after a defendant has been charged. The standard isn't probable cause anymore-- it's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

You all know how pro-prosecution I am. But even *I* was raising my eyebrows at parts of the affidavit....there were excerpts that were literally double and triple hearsay...
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:53 AM   #70
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I'm reading it, now. They actually f***ing interviewed Welch in 2003?!
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Old 04-24-2018, 01:13 PM   #71
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Quote:
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Proving the case against this guy, however, is going to be a bugger. I have never read an affidavit with so much hearsay in my life. I'm frankly struggling to see how the State is going to be able to prove the case against the Defendant.
Only a laymanís perspective here, but I was thinking the same thing when I read it.

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Old 04-24-2018, 01:54 PM   #72
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Multiple people told investigators that both Welch and Pennington been dealt methamphetamine, according to the affidavit. One person reportedly told investigators that Pennington had said that Freeman and Bible had entered a room where the Freeman parents were buying drugs on the night of the crime.

https://www.fox23.com/news/suspect-i...case/736951734

Wow. If the parents were users (and ripped off a dealer or dealers), that certainly puts a whole new spin on things (even the shooting of their son by the local Sheriff)
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Old 04-24-2018, 01:54 PM   #73
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Quote:
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Only a laymanís perspective here, but I was thinking the same thing when I read it.

Matt
Damn it, Matt, that avatar picture is killing me, even in a thread this serious.
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Old 04-24-2018, 02:39 PM   #74
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Quote:
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I read the affidavit in its entirety.

I absolutely think that what is being proposed is what happened to these poor girls. I believe the Polaroids existed at one point, although they are gone now.

Proving the case against this guy, however, is going to be a bugger. I have never read an affidavit with so much hearsay in my life. I'm frankly struggling to see how the State is going to be able to prove the case against the Defendant. Sure, they have enough to charge him, but we all know the rules change after a defendant has been charged. The standard isn't probable cause anymore-- it's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

You all know how pro-prosecution I am. But even *I* was raising my eyebrows at parts of the affidavit....there were excerpts that were literally double and triple hearsay...
Well that probably explains why nothing was done about these guys even though it sounds like they had connected them to the crime many years ago.

It doesn't matter what you know, only what you can show...
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Old 04-24-2018, 03:10 PM   #75
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Quote:
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Well that probably explains why nothing was done about these guys even though it sounds like they had connected them to the crime many years ago.

It doesn't matter what you know, only what you can show...
Not to armchair Quarterback, but... I'm about to armchair quarterback:

Their chances of a freaking conviction in this matter was way better, you know, when the other two co-defendants were alive. All this guy has to do to get acquitted (in my opinion) is keep his damn mouth shut and/or blame the other two-- they're dead. They can't defend themselves like they could if they had charged the case when all three (or at least two of them) were alive.

I need to re-read the affidavit, but it seems to me that things could have been followed up on before both co-defendants died. I'm sure the Freeman/Bible family are happy to have some answers, but I would want an explanation for why it took so dang long. And I'd want a good one.
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