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JDS84 · 02-01-2003, 08:29 PM

I have a paper due in Psychology on Tuesday. Its called a reaction paper.

Eleven year old Ma Ying came to school with that appeared to be bruise marks all over his body. After noticing these bruises the physical education teacher reported this to the school principle. The school principle. out of concern, reported this to the department of Social Services who then decided to visit the home of Ma Ying. Upon arrival at the home of Ma Ying the service agent wa greeted at the door by a very cautious Vietnamese woman. After attempting to talk to the woman the agent noticed that she spoke very little English. The service agent then pointed to the back of Ma Ying, raised his shirt and showed her bruises. The woman very loudly started shouting Gang Pa, Gang Pa while at the same time pointing to another room where the father was. The boy was taken from the home and the parents were charged with child abuse. During court proceedings it was leaned that the boy had gone through a "rites of passage" ritual that every boy his age goes through when becoming a man. This ceremony requires that the boy take several sharp blows across his back from his father. The blows across the back are administered by what is referred to as Gang Pa stick. To not go through this would have been very upsetting for the young boy. He proudly accecpted the blows from his father.
The question is:
Discuss whether or not the child was abused and whether or not the parents, particularly the father, should be punished or incarcerated for beating his child.

Brian · 02-01-2003, 08:33 PM

Maybe in Vietnam it's acceptable but whether or not it's a ritual it is abuse in this country. In this case, the child may not be emotionally or psychologically abused but in later years this could affect his health physically.

~LadyJess~ · 02-01-2003, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BJL
Maybe in Vietnam it's acceptable but whether or not it's a ritual it is abuse in this country. In this case, the child may not be emotionally or psychologically abused but in later years this could affect his health physically.

Exactly. The ritual may be acceptable somewhere else but it isn't in the US and if people are going to move here from other countries they have to accept that.

Chocoholic · 02-01-2003, 08:45 PM

I agree. Maybe it's acceptable in Vietnam, but over here child abuse is child abuse, no matter what. No child deserves to be harmed like that, even if it is considered a custom by some people.

Adele · 02-01-2003, 09:45 PM

It's not abuse. It was not done with the specific intent of harming. Besides, America supposedly allows you the freedom to practice your own religion, yes? Why would it not be excepted then?

*PinkLady* · 02-01-2003, 09:53 PM

Whether or not it was done to hurt the kid, he still got beaten up, and that's definitely abuse. Some would probably say that in that case, freedom of religion was being pushed to its limits.

White_Daisy · 02-01-2003, 09:56 PM

Female Circumcision is an important part of other cultures too. Doesn't mean that it's allowed in this country. The child is most def. abused. America may allow you to practice your religion freely, but not at the expense of others. That's how I always interpreted the Bill of Rights. You have your rights, as long as you don't trespass on other's.

dawsongirl · 02-01-2003, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Adele
It's not abuse. It was not done with the specific intent of harming. Besides, America supposedly allows you the freedom to practice your own religion, yes? Why would it not be excepted then?

That's what I was going to say. If it's only done once, then so be it. Sounds like a bar mitzvah for Vietnamese children.

Despite the fact that many Americans (myself included) think that once they come here they must become all-American, it's not going to happen.

Adele · 02-01-2003, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by White_Daisy
. You have your rights, as long as you don't trespass on other's.

"To not go through this would have been very upsetting for the young boy". He was raised with the idea...and it was ok by him. 'I' as well as you guys were raised with the idea that what he "went through" is abuse. It's completely different with another culture. They don't see it as morally wrong. However, Americans choose to believe that their ideas and beliefs are ALWAYS right. Who is really to know what is truly right or wrong, when there are so many different beliefs in the world. You cannot take one idea, and make that mean "the right thing"........People cannot be closed minded about things.

Brian · 02-01-2003, 10:13 PM

Yes the Constitution allows freedom of religion but it has some limits. I learned in government that a 19th century Mormon (the person's religion may not be entirely accurate; I had to turn in my government text book) was convicted of bigamy. He claimed that the religion allows it and it is acceptable and took it to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court upheld his conviction on the grounds that he did more than just believe in it: he acted upon it and committed an illegal act. There is a difference between believing in something and practicing it.

White_Daisy · 02-01-2003, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Adele

"To not go through this would have been very upsetting for the young boy". He was raised with the idea...and it was ok by him. 'I' as well as you guys were raised with the idea that what he "went through" is abuse. It's completely different with another culture. They don't see it as morally wrong. However, Americans choose to believe that their ideas and beliefs are ALWAYS right. Who is really to know what is truly right or wrong, when there are so many different beliefs in the world. You cannot take one idea, and make that mean "the right thing"........People cannot be closed minded about things.

The boy was being beaten. Besides, the court has no choice. Even if the child wants it, if they see signs of abuse, they have to act on it.

White_Daisy · 02-01-2003, 10:29 PM

I know that this isn't my paper, but let me give you a little bit more disgusting scenario and let's see what you think.

A girl about 11 yrs old goes to her teacher and says that she won't be in class for the next 2 weeks. The teacher is naturally concerned and asks her why. She says that she is going and getting circumcised because it's a family tradition. The girl is very eager about this and wants to get it done because it's a part of her culture. What should the teacher do?

And for those of you who don't know...Female Circumcision is done on girls entering puberty. It ranges from a slight removal of some external genitalia to removal of "everything you can see" leaving behind a pencil like hole for urination and periods. The girl will always face pain in sex and will never be able to have an orgasm. The process can be done from anyone from a proper doctor to an old woman in a tent with a kitchen knife. Many times, the girls will die of infection and shock. They are not given painkillers.

02-01-2003, 08:29 PM	#1
JDS84 Senior Member Member Join Date: Dec 11, 2001 Location: My Old Kentucky Home Posts: 3,355	Let Me Get Your Opinion On Something.... I have a paper due in Psychology on Tuesday. Its called a reaction paper. Eleven year old Ma Ying came to school with that appeared to be bruise marks all over his body. After noticing these bruises the physical education teacher reported this to the school principle. The school principle. out of concern, reported this to the department of Social Services who then decided to visit the home of Ma Ying. Upon arrival at the home of Ma Ying the service agent wa greeted at the door by a very cautious Vietnamese woman. After attempting to talk to the woman the agent noticed that she spoke very little English. The service agent then pointed to the back of Ma Ying, raised his shirt and showed her bruises. The woman very loudly started shouting Gang Pa, Gang Pa while at the same time pointing to another room where the father was. The boy was taken from the home and the parents were charged with child abuse. During court proceedings it was leaned that the boy had gone through a "rites of passage" ritual that every boy his age goes through when becoming a man. This ceremony requires that the boy take several sharp blows across his back from his father. The blows across the back are administered by what is referred to as Gang Pa stick. To not go through this would have been very upsetting for the young boy. He proudly accecpted the blows from his father. The question is: Discuss whether or not the child was abused and whether or not the parents, particularly the father, should be punished or incarcerated for beating his child. __________________ Jessica

02-01-2003, 09:56 PM	#7
White_Daisy Senior Member blank Join Date: Oct 22, 2002 Posts: 2,376	Female Circumcision is an important part of other cultures too. Doesn't mean that it's allowed in this country. The child is most def. abused. America may allow you to practice your religion freely, but not at the expense of others. That's how I always interpreted the Bill of Rights. You have your rights, as long as you don't trespass on other's. __________________ <marquee>I love you, Potsie Webber</marquee> <center> "H14...My favorite letter, my favorite number"</center> <center>http://www.obeygiant.com/stickers/bo...happy-days.gif</center> <center>They Call it Potsie Love</center> <center>http://www.tvlinksonline.com/boards/...&postid=549343</center> <center>Warren "Potsie" Webber</center> <center> To me, Fonzie is what everyone wants to be, Richie is kind of what everyone wants her son to be. And Potsie, I think, is what everyone is - Anson Williams </center>

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02-01-2003, 08:33 PM	#2
Brian Forum Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 23, 2001 Posts: 20,353	Maybe in Vietnam it's acceptable but whether or not it's a ritual it is abuse in this country. In this case, the child may not be emotionally or psychologically abused but in later years this could affect his health physically.

02-01-2003, 08:45 PM	#4
Chocoholic Banned!! Forum Veteran Banned Join Date: Dec 01, 2000 Location: Between a rock and a hard place. Posts: 11,173	I agree. Maybe it's acceptable in Vietnam, but over here child abuse is child abuse, no matter what. No child deserves to be harmed like that, even if it is considered a custom by some people.

02-01-2003, 09:45 PM	#5
Adele Forum Regular Member Join Date: May 02, 2001 Posts: 632	It's not abuse. It was not done with the specific intent of harming. Besides, America supposedly allows you the freedom to practice your own religion, yes? Why would it not be excepted then?

02-01-2003, 09:53 PM	#6
PinkLady Senior Member Member Join Date: Jun 04, 2002 Posts: 7,442	Whether or not it was done to hurt the kid, he still got beaten up, and that's definitely abuse. Some would probably say that in that case, freedom of religion was being pushed to its limits.

02-01-2003, 10:13 PM	#10
Brian Forum Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 23, 2001 Posts: 20,353	Yes the Constitution allows freedom of religion but it has some limits. I learned in government that a 19th century Mormon (the person's religion may not be entirely accurate; I had to turn in my government text book) was convicted of bigamy. He claimed that the religion allows it and it is acceptable and took it to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court upheld his conviction on the grounds that he did more than just believe in it: he acted upon it and committed an illegal act. There is a difference between believing in something and practicing it.

02-01-2003, 10:29 PM	#12
White_Daisy Senior Member blank Join Date: Oct 22, 2002 Posts: 2,376	I know that this isn't my paper, but let me give you a little bit more disgusting scenario and let's see what you think. A girl about 11 yrs old goes to her teacher and says that she won't be in class for the next 2 weeks. The teacher is naturally concerned and asks her why. She says that she is going and getting circumcised because it's a family tradition. The girl is very eager about this and wants to get it done because it's a part of her culture. What should the teacher do? And for those of you who don't know...Female Circumcision is done on girls entering puberty. It ranges from a slight removal of some external genitalia to removal of "everything you can see" leaving behind a pencil like hole for urination and periods. The girl will always face pain in sex and will never be able to have an orgasm. The process can be done from anyone from a proper doctor to an old woman in a tent with a kitchen knife. Many times, the girls will die of infection and shock. They are not given painkillers.