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Old 01-29-2012, 03:11 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesG
I do value human life and feel that it should never be taken. However, if I feel my life is at risk I'm doing everything possible to defend it, and I wouldn't blame others who kill their attackers if they feel their life is at risk.

However if you feel your life is in jeopardy in an assault and attempted robbery and you kill your aggressor/s in the process, that is ok and that's the reason why the man has no charges while the other 2 teens have charges pending.

That's where you and I differ and where I say it's just a different value system. Personally, yes, I would rather die than take another person's life. That's just me though. And why I still feel sorry for the teenager who died and never got a chance to turn his life around. I think it's rather rotten of you and others to have the "he asked for it" opinion. That's just disgusting in my eyes.
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Old 01-29-2012, 03:18 PM   #17
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By the way, this happened about 20 minutes away from where I live. The teenager that died could easily have been the nephew/younger brother/neighbor of someone I know. Teenagers make mistakes and get into trouble. I'm not excusing what they did, but THEY DID NOT DESERVE TO DIE FOR IT. Yeah, I'm sure their parents made mistakes, but did they deserve to have to bury their son for it? That's why I'm so upset. This did not need to happen.
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Old 01-29-2012, 03:33 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liza
That's where you and I differ and where I say it's just a different value system. Personally, yes, I would rather die than take another person's life. That's just me though. And why I still feel sorry for the teenager who died and never got a chance to turn his life around. I think it's rather rotten of you and others to have the "he asked for it" opinion. That's just disgusting in my eyes.

Well he did "ask for it".

Come on, at 15 and 16 years old you should know better than attempting to rob an older man and knocking him off his bicycle. Teens do many stupid things for fun, but assault and robbery is a whole other ball park.



Waking up late to get to school on time is a mistake.

Forgetting to take out the trash is a mistake.

Knocking an older man off his bike, beating him up and attempting to rob him making him fear for his life isn't a mistake. That sounds malicious and planned out to me.

I also read in the news that this older man was the 3RD VICTIM of this robbery spree on that day. These teens were looking for trouble, planned out what they were doing, and payed for it.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:10 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesG
Well he did "ask for it".

Come on, at 15 and 16 years old you should know better than attempting to rob an older man and knocking him off his bicycle. Teens do many stupid things for fun, but assault and robbery is a whole other ball park.

Waking up late to get to school on time is a mistake.

Forgetting to take out the trash is a mistake.

Knocking an older man off his bike, beating him up and attempting to rob him making him fear for his life isn't a mistake. That sounds malicious and planned out to me.

I also read in the news that this older man was the 3RD VICTIM of this robbery spree on that day. These teens were looking for trouble, planned out what they were doing, and payed for it.

That's the most disgusting thing I've ever heard of. Knocking a guy off a bike and robbing him does not deserve death. BOTTOM LINE IN MY BOOK. I'm sorry that you just don't understand that life is more important than anything else.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:14 PM   #20
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I almost died in a car accident last month, and I want to have children very much very soon. LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN ANYTHING ELSE. I don't care what other circumstances are out there. I don't care about robbery, assault or anything else. LIFE IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:21 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liza
That's the most disgusting thing I've ever heard of. Knocking a guy off a bike and robbing him does not deserve death. BOTTOM LINE IN MY BOOK. I'm sorry that you just don't understand that life is more important than anything else.

I don't understand what's so tough about this:

The older man was in fear for his LIFE, knocked off his bike and beat up by three punks. He could have been very seriously injured, if not killed.

Yeah, life is important, and the older man defended his LIFE.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesG
I don't understand what's so tough about this:

The older man was in fear for his LIFE, knocked off his bike and beat up by three punks.

Yeah, life is important, and the older man defended his LIFE.

I don't care. It was an attempted robbery. He should never have ended a child's life. Even if they had attempted his life (which they didn't). Again, those are just my values.

And I think you're a disgusting person to condemn the parents for having a teenager that got into a bad crowd and made mistakes. It doesn't justify their losing their son forever. And the fact that you have no compassion for them says a lot about your values.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:27 PM   #23
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I did come very close to losing my life very recently. Maybe that's the reason I place such a high value on it. And why I have no patience for those who point fingers and condemn others.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:28 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Liza
I don't care. It was an attempted robbery. He should never have ended a child's life. Even if they had attempted his life (which they didn't). Again, those are just my values.

And I think you're a disgusting person to condemn the parents for having a teenager that got into a bad crowd and made mistakes. It doesn't justify their losing their son forever. And the fact that you have no compassion for them says a lot about your values.

Given that at one point you defended Leslie Van Houten (saying that she's no longer threat), I'm not at all surprised you'd say something as distasteful as this. Knowing you, I bet you also approve of the Superme's Court Decision to abolish Death Penalty in California.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:28 PM   #25
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I value human life as much as anyone but I have to side with the assault victim in this case. What else was he supposed to do? He was lucky the fall from the bike didn't kill him and then after being knocked off his bike, he was assaulted by 2 of the thugs who could easily have killed him and if you're in a situation like that, you don't stop to think about what you should do, you take immediate and whatever action is deemed necessary to survive. It's sad that a person had to die as a result of this crime but the man was only trying to protect himself and was well within his rights to do so.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:29 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liza
I don't care. It was an attempted robbery. He should never have ended a child's life. Even if they had attempted his life (which they didn't). Again, those are just my values.

And I think you're a disgusting person to condemn the parents for having a teenager that got into a bad crowd and made mistakes. It doesn't justify their losing their son forever. And the fact that you have no compassion for them says a lot about your values.

I think we should end this here because we aren't going to change anybody's minds and nothing good can come from discussing it further.

I'm a disgusting person... wow.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:33 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vahan
Given that at one point you defended Leslie Van Houten (saying that she's no longer threat), I'm not at all surprised you'd say something as distasteful as this.

That's neither here nor there, and if you recall, I had sympathy for Leslie because she NEVER killed anyone. And I've been on the fence about her for a long time, neither on one side nor another. So why you brought up that makes no sense.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:34 PM   #28
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I think we should end this here because we aren't going to change anybody's minds and nothing good can come from discussing it further.

I'm a disgusting person... wow.

Maybe not a disgusting person, but your values as to human life are disgusting to me. And you've been nasty about my opinions, so you have no right to be offended.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:36 PM   #29
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It seems I made a mistake in coming back here. I've been gone for months. I lost my job and nearly died in the last month. I thought I might get some support here. No, I just got people calling me distasteful and ridiculous. Go ahead, guys. Kick me. I'm down. Maybe I'll come back in 2013.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:39 PM   #30
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Quote:
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Maybe not a disgusting person, but your values as to human life are disgusting to me. And you've been nasty about my opinions, so you have no right to be offended.

I haven't been nasty. I said how I truthfully felt in a respectful manner (at least to me it was, and I'm sorry if it came off the wrong way). I never went for personal attacks calling you disgusting as you called me. I didn't call you ridiculous, I said your view was.

What's disgusting about my human life values? To say that people can't or shouldn't kill to protect it?
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