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Old 01-01-2008, 05:52 PM   #91
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I might be an aspiring defense attorney, but some cases still amaze me, one is in Michigan, Wiseguy you might know this one, back in October, Orange Taylor III had a mis-trial on all charges, his re-trial I believe is supposed to begin later this month although I dont know if it has been delayed or not.

But this case was from Eastern Michigan University, apperantly he murdered another student according to prosecutors, yet the university covered it up and claimed it was an accident and if these charges are true, a murderer was allowed to roam free for over two months before anyone even knew a murder had been committed? The university tried saying the girls death was due to natural causes, no doubt in an effort to avoid a civil suit from her family.

Taylor was caught on survilleance camera leaving her dorm, he apperantly had a history of burglaries on campus, he was a student there but had at least two or three arrests but wasnt kicked out of school, he must have either got the charges dropped or took plea bargains.

But the real kicker, his defense attorney was pretty clever here, his semen was found on the floor of the dead girl's dorm room, obviously he couldnt lie and say it wasnt his, because then he would be caught in a lie and it would make him look guilty, so he had to come up with some explaination for it being there, he has admitted breaking into the room, but claims she was already dead when he entered the room. He said upon seeing her body, he didnt know she was dead and that he masterbated at the site of her body. That is his justification for that being there.

He was charged with sexual assault even though there is no evidence he actually sexually assaulted her as his semen was not found inside her body. He was also charged with first degree murder, burglary and theft I believe, but he had a mis-trial on all charges, it was a pretty big surprise, at least to me.

It was revealed that more than one juror had voted not guilty, although the majority were in favor of conviction, but I'm still surprised they wouldnt convict him at least of burglary and theft since he even admitted to doing that, but oh well.
YES! I followed this case on CourtTV.com. I COULD NOT BELIEVE it resulted in a hung jury. Again, CRicci the former "junior prosecutor" tends to believe that this guy is probably guilty, but I have to admit that his defense strategy is interesting.

From my understanding, the defense spun the tale that the victim had a heart murmur which was the cause of her death. I'm not sure of that, but I will admit that it's a pretty interesting defense. I think I read his next trial will be in February. You can bet that I'll be following it closely.

As for my reasons for not being a prosecutor, it's pretty simple. I was a desperate law student looking for secure employment to pay off my student loans. I had interviewed for some Assistant District Attorney positions, but was offered a job with a private law firm first. I took the job with the private law firm, only to get a few offers to become a prosecutor later. I started doing criminal defense work as a way to keep in touch with Criminal Law, which was my passion in law school.

PM me if you have any questions about the law school process, Kadrmas. I'm more than happy to answer.
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Old 01-01-2008, 05:57 PM   #92
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Wiseguy - My original comments were regarding the subject of retirement posts in general - not yours specifically. While you keep raising issues about things in your specific retirement post, I will not criticize it and I don't feel as though I have done so. The purpose of my post was not to criticize anyone in particular and I hope I made that clear. That being said though, I am finding it difficult to express my thoughts on the subject without touching on issues that you brought up in your retirement post, and I feel like I am treading on thin ice here. I guess what I want to say is that while I understand the need for someone to say a "farewell" to the online community to abate rumors, and "where did they go" type questions I also think that such posts can often come across as self serving, and in some cases, insulting to other board members if not handled very carefully. A "goodbye, its been swell" type comment leaves less room for interpretation than does paragraph after paragraph outlining problems the poster is having with the board, disagreements with other posters, etc. Again, this is my opinion of how such "retirement" posts often come across through my eyes, but I won't hesitate to say that I think that a lot of readers have similar feelings on this issue, hence the response you received.

As for the AWSI business, I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up, unless it really bothers you and I'm going to assume it does. If it does bother you, can I ask why? Okay, he dissed us, and he's gone on to post on other boards, so what? As I said to kadrmas, this is a message board, don't take things to heart. As you said (and I'm paraphrasing) it's not like we know each other in real life or are "friends" here. I don't give AWSI, or anyone else here for that matter, a second thought once the computer turns off. Kadrmas's comment about this seeming like a job kind of concerned me. If posting here is so stressful, then maybe it' is worth taking some time off to relax and put things back into perspective.

And, to answer your questions, I have known people to "retire" and come back on other boards I read. If anything, it makes the whole retirement issue even more comical, and reinforces my belief that these posts tend to be, with some small exceptions, BS.
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Old 01-01-2008, 06:04 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by wiseguy182
Awsi must really like you then because several people have told me that he has ignored them since his leaving.

wasn't this the guy who said he had handicapped everyone on the forum? how reassuring to know someone kept tabs on all of our faults.

I think the reason he left was because he was talked to about his off topic posts. If one looked at all of his posts, one would guess that, if there were 5 segments in an hour of UM, one would be about unsolved mysteries, one about football, one about politics, and one about Las Vegas, and one would be what should have been private messages between him and SiberianKiss.
Geez, are you ever going to get over Awsi?
20 or 30 emails wondering where you have gone... yeah O-K
There is no retiring, if you want to "quit" then do so but do we need these long winding, attention seeking, emo stories.
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Old 01-02-2008, 12:17 AM   #94
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Well, I cant speak for Awsi or Wiseguy, but I can speak for myself, when I say that my post was not to create attention. It was to state my point and lay all the cards on the table which I did. I actually feel much better about this whole situation now that I have done that.

As for Awsi, well I dont think Wiseguy is obsessed with him or not over him. I think Wiseguy's opinion, now this is just my interpretation, is that Wiseguy feels Awsi's exit was rather classless, he also feels it was immature on Awsi's part, but again that is just my interpretation of that. I wish Awsi would come back, but it doesnt appear that will happen so I wish him well.

CRicci, yes that case was pretty amazing that he got a mis-trial. I have seen people convicted off a lot less. Although to be fair, while Orange Taylor probably murdered this young woman, there actually was no real evidence that he murdered or sexually assaulted her.

But he was in the room. He initially lied about that to police until he realized he was caught on survilleance camera then he knew he had to admit it because they said they had his DNA so he knew he had to explain how it got in the room and stuff, so he was basically forced to put himself at the scene and claim he had done his business at the sight of her.

The defense was pretty clever in the Orange Taylor case and clearly they were able to cause enough doubt in at least a couple jurors minds that he wasnt convicted, his defense came up with some clever theories and to be honest, while some might be far fetched or sound lame, they were clever enough that they could fit the evidence and justify things, basically, the prosecution I dont feel proved that Orange Taylor raped and killed this young woman, all they proved was that he burglarized her room and stole stuff.

Well, this young woman was an athlete at Eastern Michigan University, but it was true she did have a heart condition that was stress related. She appearantly had a stress related arrythmia, and she had supposedly had a couple of fainting episodes because of this arrythmia but that it hadnt been thought of as a fatal medical condition in itself, but could be fatal if, lets say you passed out and fell hitting your head on something.

I am actually surprised, Taylor just didnt plead guilty, to burglary and theft, he would get probably half the time he would if found guilty at trial, plus, he might get acquitted of murder and sexual assault although I think that is a long shot, if there is a mis-trial, the state's chances of conviction go up dramatically, in the 2nd trial. I think in this case, it was a combination of an above average defense presenting interesting theories and the prosecution underestimating the defense that led to the mis-trial, but I was still surprised that Orange Taylor got a mis-trial. Do I think Orange Taylor is responsible for the death of this young woman? Probably, but this case was not exactly the slam dunk that the prosecution presented it to be, they over simplified it.

Yes, Orange Taylor broke into the room, yes he stole stuff, he is guilty of both of those crimes, but as sick as it may be, a guy doing his business onto the floor of a young woman's room I do not believe is a crime and there was no evidence of sexual assault, the defense suggested that she died from her medical condition, that she passed out and hit her head on something I believe.

But there was another case in Michigan a few years ago, involving a lawyer named Michael "Mick" Fletcher who was convicted of 2nd degree murder in the death of his wife. I never thought there was much real evidence, regardless if one thinks he did it or not, there has to be real evidence to lead to conviction and this was a case, where the prosecutors admitted they had no physical evidence that proved Fletcher killed his wife.

However he was still convicted, basically because they dragged him through the mud and the prosecution admitted they were going to do so in their opening statement. Fletcher should have never been convicted off the evidence or lack of it presented at trial.

I mean, yes, the guy was having an affair with a judge, she even steered cases his way as he was a defense attorney, she was the youngest judge in Michigan at the time, she was a rising star whose career was de-railed by this.

However basically, they got a guy convicted of murder because he was having an affair, because his marriage had been in trouble long before he was having that affair and because he had a book on criminal investigations in his house.

I mean the guy was a defense attorney, having such a book in his house would be nothing unusual, I mean, if he is this murderer, why would he leave a book like that right out in the open for the cops to find? I know people can be arrogant but I dont think anyone would be that arrogant.
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Old 01-02-2008, 12:37 AM   #95
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Oh, hey Wiseguy, thanks for standing up for me, I meant to thank you for that and hadnt, so I want to thank you for that. I appreciate you doing what you did, because I would have never thought you would have, considering what happened in the past.
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Old 01-02-2008, 12:43 AM   #96
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Well Wiseguy, I will say this once, we will have to agree to disagree here, there are different races of different people. While it isnt politically correct to mention people's races, I feel extreme political correctness is very detrimental and counter productive.

Like when you and I had that disagreement about whether or not the guy in the Dennis Walker segment should have said "cotton picking" hands or not when referring to the state taking back Dennis Walker's property. I am sure the guy meant no disrespect towards blacks even if you for whatever reason interpreted it that way. It was 1987 or 88 too when that segment was filmed, twenty years ago, a different atmosphere, a different time.

Yes, if you want to be politically correct about it, yes I guess he could have used a better choice of words, but honestly, I never even thought about race when he said that comment, until ironically enough, you brought it up.

I have no doubt that you are well intentioned when you are politically correct, though you take it to the extreme sometimes, just like I take plenty of things to the extreme, whether it is slamming people, getting overly emotional, whatever, it happens, it is unfortunate but it does, neither one of us mean any harm, it just gets out of hand sometimes.

I do not think Awsi is a racist, I mean, is anyone that brings up race a racist? Like, if the offender happens to be a minority race, whether it is politically correct or not, that offenders race needs to be said, in fact, it needs to be said whether they are white or a minority. If you just say, the offender is a guy with some hair, some skin and a tattoo, that wont distinguish him from lots of the other people out there.

I guess for me, I dont buy into politically correctness much, no matter how well intentioned it may be, political correctness taken to the extreme is very counter productive and it makes it so people are cherry picking their comments, making sure they dont say anything which might potentially offend someone.
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Old 01-02-2008, 12:58 AM   #97
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Quote:
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To your credit, I don't feel I was singled out. Since I was the only one on here who retired and came back, I thought I would stick up for kadrmas on this issue because I could tell the same thing that was happening to him had happened to me: and I don't want anyone getting ganged up on, especially when they don't deserve it.

Justin, you can say what you want to me. This forum is nothing compared to everything I've endured in life. While I do respond to things I disagree with, I'm extremely thick skinned.

To you and everyone, I will state again: You misintrepreted my final post from awhile back: I was just trying to let you all know that, while I do post some comments that come off as kind of abrasive, I am still a very nice person. That is the only thing I intended to accomplish in the post, other than let people know I had planned on leaving. No sticking it to enemies or seeking praise.

I read your comment on people on other boards that have retired and come back, but how were we supposed to know that? Outside of a twilight zone forum I joined just last week, I don't post anywhere else regularly.

As for the Awsi business, I wouldn't mention it if I didn't keep reading comments about how much Awsi is missed. I still don't get it. He only quit because he couldn't post off topic anymore, and told us what we were all doing is worthless: yet had he not been told that, he would still be posting here. I wasn't going to mention this, but there were two separate occasions where he went out of his way to mention the color of skin of ciminals (on cases that happened where he lived, not on UM). He was busy yapping it up about Las vegas, politics and football while we were all sympathizing for victims. Discriminatory comments about bikers and rooting for the scammers to get away scot free. Does this not bother anyone else?

I understand this isn't pleasant to talk about, but I think it's necessary.
Wiseguy - To be honest, I really don't see this going any further. I feel like my posts have served their purpose - to let you and anyone else who may care to know why there is some times a backlash to retirement posts. I have no desire to dig up your specific retirement post and pick it apart and rehash all that. You've stated your position on why you felt the way you did when you wrote the post, and that's fine.

As for AWSI, I liked his posts. I used to travel to Vegas a lot so I did find them interesting, even though, as you have pointed out, a lot of the stuff he wrote wasn't about UM. I was unaware of the racist comments. If he did make such remarks, then that is a whole 'nother can of worms. I don't recall what was said, and if you want to point out what he said, I would be interested in reading those comments. I believe you are being truthful, yet I don't care to go searching through all his posts to find them. But if he did make racist remarks, that is really not cool, and I may have to reevaluate.
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Old 01-02-2008, 01:06 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseguy182
can you prove I or anyone else that has retired didn't get 20 or 30 e-mails? yeah didn't think so, speculative comments like that one are never a good idea.

I can't get over Awsi because there's nothing to get over. He's a complete non-factor in my life. I just brought him up recently because I thought it was bogus how he dissed the forum and people still treat him like a forum hero, whereas I have done alot of nice things for people on here and got scoffed at it.

I don't know what you're problem is lately, but I won't be getting any more of your dvd's.
I'm sure in your own little world you got those 20 emails hey.
You're the only one who clings onto things that happen at least a year ago, time to let it go don't you think?
No more DVDs?!?? Oh no, what will I do?
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Old 01-02-2008, 01:22 AM   #99
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It is my opinion neither of those are racist, he mentioned "hispanic gentlemen" and a "black woman" that isnt racist unless you consider the fact he mentioned what race they were racist. Would you consider it racist if he mentioned a white person's race? I see what point you are trying to make wiseguy, but I cant say that I agree with it.
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Old 01-02-2008, 01:23 AM   #100
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Wow, SI, that was pretty classless, you are getting down to my level now. Taking cheap shots, I mean are you taking lessons from me on how to be a jerk or something?
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Old 01-02-2008, 02:19 AM   #101
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Hey, so people interviewed on UM that I just didn't like....

Have I mentioned my deep affinity for Paul Pollis?

Just sayin'....
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Old 01-02-2008, 10:17 AM   #102
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Okay enough of the pro and anti Awsi comments and anything related to the SK posts as well. The private message function if there for a reason if anyone wants to continue this debate and there are starting to be way too many off topic posts on here.

As far as back to the subject of this thread its a given that the people I really didn't like are Paul Pollis, Chad Noe, Mark Nichols and of course Jule Caylor. I also took offense to the comments made by Cynthia Anderson's father about how spending too much time on her face could have contributed somehow to her disappearance....what in the world? Hopefully he didn't mean it like it came out.
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Old 01-02-2008, 03:21 PM   #103
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Someone interviewed who I didn't dislike so much as be throughly and horribly frightened by their appearance so much so that I just sat there frozen stiff and crying, was the Canadian investigator in the bizarre segment about the Canadian man who ended up murdered in Tennessee.

That cop looks so much like a living puppet it scared the motherfathering dog piss outta me. His eyes, his skin, his ears...man just thinking of the guy gives me the willies.

The guy's mom was pretty bizarre too. She had this weird wa of looking side to side when she talked and I couldn't tell if she had an accent or not but she had this way of enunciating where I didn't expect enunciations.

But...you know...they are Canadian.
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Old 01-02-2008, 04:15 PM   #104
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Haha, yeah that is funny Corky, yeah, those Canadians are a strange bunch, but they are our best friends in the world afterall, we protect them and bail them out of all sorts of trouble. Remember when the Canadian authorities didnt seem to investigate the Philip Frazier case as aggressively because he was "just an American" ?

Let's see here, people interviewed on UM I didnt like, Mark Nichols, Jule Caylor, Paul Pollis, Chad Noe, Chad Noe's mother, Chad Noe's grandmother, the prosecutor in the Larry Race case, the prosecutor in the Glen Consagra case, the prosecutor in the Stuart Heaton case, the assistant attorney general of Florida who was fighting Tommy Ziegler's appeal, Cindy Anderson's dad, the guy just gave me the creeps, I am sorry for what happened with Cindy and all but I just got a really bad vibe off the guy, the dude from Massachusetts, Scott something, that ran off on his family, was gone for over 3 years living this new life, then when they find him, the kicker is he makes them move to where he is at, pretty classless if you ask me.

Oh who else? Doyle, the service station attendent who wrongfully picked out Michael Scott Martin, the Sheriff that allowed Rob Bonderson to get away with murder, who else? Donovan Jacobs, those neighbors, especially the dude with the mullet who heard Crystal Spencer getting murdered and decided to just ignore the blood curdling screams that sounded like they came from a Hitchcock film and go back to sleep because they were scared of "getting involved." Yes, I suppose it would be less scary letting a murderer and rapist roam free.
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Old 01-02-2008, 07:31 PM   #105
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Ohhh, Crystaldawn. The ACTUAL defense attorney says "Hey!"
Okay confess Cricci you really are a prosecutor trapped in a defense attorney's body aren't you?
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