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Old 06-05-2007, 11:41 AM   #91
mozartpc27
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I just re-watched this case for the first time in a long time on crystaldawn's DVDs volume 2.

At first, I would be inclined to agree with those who have suggested that the incident with the guy who stopped by to make a telephone call was unrelated to the rest of the incidents. 10 years is a long time. But, there are two problems: 1) if it was an unrelated, random robbery, why was the stuff returned, piecemeal, over the next several months? And 2) what was up with the graffiti written in crayon on the Wacker's wall: "cheaper, but will do"?

The second part still mystifies me --- I can't imagine why anyone would write such a cryptic phrase (I even looked at the possibility it was an acroynm for something else, and it's interesting to note that, but for a missing "K," you can spell Bill Wacker out of the letters in the phrase, though you are left with h, p, e, r, u, t, d, and o) --- but the first part strongly suggests that the robbery either 1) never happened or 2) was orchestrated by someone who knew the Wackers.

My best guess is that it was one or both of their sons-in-law, perhaps hiring a third party and working in cohoots. The children here would be the only people with a sensible motive: perhaps they were attempting to force the Wackers to sell and move in with one of the children's families, and in this way gain access to the cash from the sale of the house. This would even give some rational meaning to that first bit of graffiti: any history of crime drives the value of a property down, but, if the house was worth a decent amount of money before the "incidents," it would sell for "cheaper," but for the purposes of the family of one of their daughters, it "will do." It would also help to explain how the "surveillance" was cracked. Perhaps one of the sons-in-law planted the note well before any sounds were made, then did whatever he needed to do to appear to be participating in the surveillance, and finally was able to slip away from his station at the last minute just long enough to make some bangs, and then appear on the front porch with the rest of the family, leading them all to find his note while he blamed the entire incident on a disappearing "kook."

That's a stretch to explain the graffiti of course, but, like I said, if I had a guess, one or possibly both of the two sons-in-law, perhaps without the knowledge of his wife/their wives (or, then again, perhaps with her/their knowledge), was attempting to force them to sell the house and move in with his family, and hoping to then gain access to whatever cash the Wackers got from the sale. I wonder if the police ever looked into any debts either of the sons-in-law might have had.
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Old 06-05-2007, 11:07 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mozartpc27
At first, I would be inclined to agree with those who have suggested that the incident with the guy who stopped by to make a telephone call was unrelated to the rest of the incidents. 10 years is a long time. But, there are two problems: 1) if it was an unrelated, random robbery, why was the stuff returned, piecemeal, over the next several months? And 2) what was up with the graffiti written in crayon on the Wacker's wall: "cheaper, but will do"?.... My best guess is that it was one or both of their sons-in-law, perhaps hiring a third party and working in cohoots. The children here would be the only people with a sensible motive: perhaps they were attempting to force the Wackers to sell and move in with one of the children's families, and in this way gain access to the cash from the sale of the house. This would even give some rational meaning to that first bit of graffiti: any history of crime drives the value of a property down, but, if the house was worth a decent amount of money before the "incidents," it would sell for "cheaper," but for the purposes of the family of one of their daughters, it "will do."

I think this theory makes the most sense of any offered so far. If the Wackers were making the whole thing up, it seems highly unlikely they would have thought of such a strange touch.

Interestingly, if you search for the phrase "cheaper, but will do" on Google, not that much comes up. But one of the things that comes up is a site whose short description on the search results page mentions "cheaper but will do" and then "wacker." When I tried to go to this site, however, it is one of those "your computer is filled with viruses! Let us help by downloading our helpful malware software!" sites. Probably the short description on the search page is based on some metatags chosen to help people find the site, but it's a strange coincidence that someone chose the Wackers and that phrase. It's unlikely the phrase coupled with the name Wacker was picked up by some bot, since the phrase and name don't otherwise show up together in Google. Some UM junkie, perhaps.
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Old 06-06-2007, 02:29 AM   #93
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Regardless of their age though, if you were living in fear of threats and your husband is out of the house and you are alone you would not let a total stranger into your home.


[quote=kadrmas15]Also, in regards to the Wackers, I think people are either unable or unwilling to take into account they are from a past generation. It used to be you could actually help a person out, let them into their house, etc without having to worry about them attacking you or taking advantage of you or stealing, etc. It wouldnt even have entered this generations minds that such a thing could happen.
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Old 06-06-2007, 03:52 AM   #94
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It is believable to me that the Wackers are victims, but I have thought of a couple more unanswered questions:

1. As much as I love Unsolved Mysteries, they were notorious for leaving out some crucial details, and I believe this is one of those instances. I'm really curious to know exactly how the stakeout went. We don't know where Bill and his sons-in-law were when they heard the "bump, bump, bump, bump" Then Stack says something like "the perpetrator found a blind spot." This would indicate that not only did the perpetrator knew that they were holed up in a vehicle nearby, but knew which vehicle they were in. If they were on stakeout for several hours (which it seems like), that would probably indicate that the perpretrator was in the area the whole time, but had to wait for his opportunity. Waiting all that time just to throw something on the porch is going an incredibly long distance to put one self in a situation where they really don't gain anything out of it. This would mean that this criminal is one of the most brazen and smartest ones ever on UM IMO, and is also the one that goes to the greatest lengths.

2. At the beginning of the segment, Dorothy apparently makes enough noise (when she's tied up, and has something covering her mouth) to alert the neighbors. It must be extremely difficult to make that amount of noise when one is tied up. So it appears that the neighbors have remarkable hearing. Yet when the neighbors are asked if they heard anything, they haven't. The houses appear to be pretty close to each other, so it seems that if there was a loud "bump, bump, bump, bump" that the neighbors would hear it also, but they don't. Nor do they hear any noises the perpretrator would make. They seem to transition from remarkably excellent hearing to remarkably poor hearing.

3. I agree that older people would be more trusting, but the Wackers house had already been ransacked once or twice when Dorothy's first phsyical attack occured. A house ransacking would put most people on guard, and they would be particularly careful who they let in the door. It is even more peculiar that Dorothy would let the guy in when his truck is not in sight, why wouldn't he go to neighbors that are in closer proximity to his truck?

bizarre case: no apparent motives, no suspects, not much evidence.
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Old 06-06-2007, 04:37 AM   #95
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Quote:
1. As much as I love Unsolved Mysteries, they were notorious for leaving out some crucial details, and I believe this is one of those instances. I'm really curious to know exactly how the stakeout went. We don't know where Bill and his sons-in-law were when they heard the "bump, bump, bump, bump" Then Stack says something like "the perpetrator found a blind spot." This would indicate that not only did the perpetrator knew that they were holed up in a vehicle nearby, but knew which vehicle they were in. If they were on stakeout for several hours (which it seems like), that would probably indicate that the perpretrator was in the area the whole time, but had to wait for his opportunity. Waiting all that time just to throw something on the porch is going an incredibly long distance to put one self in a situation where they really don't gain anything out of it. This would mean that this criminal is one of the most brazen and smartest ones ever on UM IMO, and is also the one that goes to the greatest lengths.

I agree, Wiseguy, but this is a point I raised earlier. Bill was allegedly in the camper parked in the driveway and his relatives were in a van across the street. As I mentioned in a previous post, it would be impossible for anyone to know Bill and friends were staking the house out unless that person had a vantage point of the house that would allow them an almost constant (and concealed) point of view. Since no neighbors fit the description of the alleged attacker, then this scenario must be ruled out. As far as I am aware, the house is surrounded by other houses. There are no close-by concealment areas.

As you say, this "perpetrator" must have been extremely stealthy and brilliant or he was the invisible man.

And there is no motive or suspects because something that doesn't exist cannot be found.

I still want to know if any of the relatives of the Wackers came on the segment to tell the story? How about neighbors? I don't recall any, but it has been a while since I have seen the segment.
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Old 06-06-2007, 05:28 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thiussat
I agree, Wiseguy, but this is a point I raised earlier.

I still want to know if any of the relatives of the Wackers came on the segment to tell the story? How about neighbors? I don't recall any, but it has been a while since I have seen the segment.


You talked about the topic of the stakeout, I just expanded on it.

To answer your question, I rewatched the segment yesterday, and none of the actual family members or neighbors were on the segment. There were a couple of actors portraying a daughter and a neighbor, but they were non-speaking roles.
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:28 AM   #97
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Oh hello!! What's my name doing in this week's "Melrose"?!?! I'm not due untill next week when I steal Kellie away from Josh who is fighting with Megan....
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Old 06-06-2007, 05:44 PM   #98
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Quote:
To answer your question, I rewatched the segment yesterday, and none of the actual family members or neighbors were on the segment. There were a couple of actors portraying a daughter and a neighbor, but they were non-speaking roles.

Just as I suspected. No one came forward to back their story. Thanks Wiseguy.
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Old 06-06-2007, 08:03 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseguy182
To answer your question, I rewatched the segment yesterday, and none of the actual family members or neighbors were on the segment. There were a couple of actors portraying a daughter and a neighbor, but they were non-speaking roles.

Actually there is an on camera interview during the segment with the Wacker's daughter. She talks about how they keep changing their phone number and these people are able to get it.
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:15 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crystaldawn
Actually there is an on camera interview during the segment with the Wacker's daughter. She talks about how they keep changing their phone number and these people are able to get it.

Oh I do recall that now, it must have been brief though.
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Old 06-07-2007, 10:25 AM   #101
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To me, this case screams Munchausen Syndrome and old folks looking for attention/sympathy. Not to come off crass, but older folks (and little kids) have been known to over dramatize (and you could even go as far as saying brag about) aches and pains and various trials and tribulations in life. I think Bill and Dorothy just really "kicked it up a notch" and got all the way to UM with their shenanigans.

"Why should we move?" WHY? I mean, come on, if some "kooks" really were terrorizing you to this extent, you get the hell away. I don't care how proud you are and are unwilling to let anyone force you to leave, after awhile the fight is just not worth it, and any sane person gets the hell out of the situation.
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Old 01-24-2008, 03:54 AM   #102
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Okay I just watched this segment very very interesting.

I would like to believe the Wackers I couldn't possibly believe they both fabricated all this. I believe that if anything one of them fabricated it by themselves be than the husband or wife. I can't imagine it happening together, you don't just go after 40 years of marriage...hmmm life is getting a bit boring....how about we fabricate a huge story about people breaking into our house and leaving strange notes....yeah right!
So therefore IF one of the Wackers did make up this story for 10 years i'd have to believe that they are going a little looney and maybe they do really believe it is happening.
My very own Grandpa who is 85 years old tells us of this guy who prowls around her house when she is gardening. She also mentioned a strange note someone left her saying something and stolen something and then later returned it a few months after. We never saw that note. She has also been robbed twice when she was out gardening, even though she says she locks her doors everytime she goes out yet these two times she forgot and the intruder got in and knew exactly where she keeps her money in her room and got it then managed to run out before anyone could catch him. She has also said that this guy has watched her from outside sometimes and she has seen him.
Yet she doesn't seem to be fazed by that yet she is an 85 year old lady living in a house by herself. Even if some weird guy was watching me from outside the house i would be **** scared and i'm 22! I would at least call my closest relative or girlfriend. She told my parents about it like a week or 2 later.

Now do I believe my very own grandma? Well yes i do, but some of those things don't ad up. One of the main reasons i do believe her is that she doesn't make these stories up all the time. Many of those things happen like 2 years apart. You would think if she was making them up she would do it more regularly. If she did happen to be making these things up i'd imagine that she is just going a little crazy in her old age and thinking these things are happening to her.
Anyway what i'm trying to say is that maybe just maybe one of them were going a bit looney. I can't really explain the head injuries but that's just a thought.

Let's say they didn't do it though, you would have to think maybe the intruders are getting from underground somehow i don't know. I found it very weird how the Mrs. Wacker could not remember what the unknown guy was saying on the phone? Surely she would have overheard what he was saying whether it was strange or not. Plus why didn't they look at the phone records to see if that call was actually made? Or was it too late once they identified that the husband was a possible suspect?

Also why didn't they get the old guy to write in his opposite hand to the hand he writes with. They may have been able to identify if the handwriting matched.

If i think of anymore points i'll mention them later.

-Ben
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Old 02-07-2008, 01:05 AM   #103
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I thought either it was indeed the husband or someone in the family....bottom line there was one part of the segment to me that gave this away....the night they set up the entire watch party outside and the culprit still somehow managed to sneak a note onto the back porch of the house....there is no way that the suspect could have been anyone else in my opinion or they would have been caught, they had to know there was a watch party setup and they were already in place long before, only the family could have known this.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:31 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MBW0529
I thought either it was indeed the husband or someone in the family....bottom line there was one part of the segment to me that gave this away....the night they set up the entire watch party outside and the culprit still somehow managed to sneak a note onto the back porch of the house....there is no way that the suspect could have been anyone else in my opinion or they would have been caught, they had to know there was a watch party setup and they were already in place long before, only the family could have known this.

I always wondered what the police thought of this case. The officer interviewed didn't really seem to have an opinion, or at least he didn't share it on camera.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:43 PM   #105
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This is such a weird case but I have to agree with the masses here, I don't think that someone would launch multiple attacks like that on themselves. But, I do think that they know more than their telling! For instance, when Mrs. Wacker was tied-up and attacked by the "unknown" assailant, why didn't she file a police report or able to give an accurate description? And there is a lot of things that could be done even back then. Tape recordings, alarm systems, tapping the phone & tracing the calls etc. why wasn't any of that done? I think they know the person who is doing this, and keep unwittingly giving them their "unlisted" telephone number, and I think it's someone who has an axe to grind, but who? Who would have so much against an old couple that they would orchistrate such harassment? What could they have done to this person to cause them to attack them like that? Maybe it's a neighbor who is doing this; but I can't figure out what someone would have to gain by torturing and old couple?
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