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Old 08-11-2018, 07:11 PM   #16
rhzunam
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Just saw the case again in UM. To me the way the covered it, it's almost an embodiment of the Patrice O'Neal set about "racism and who white women are treated" from his big special. 9 people disappear and it all revolves around the white woman. Florian is a suspect but at least he gets a name, nothing is almost mentioned about the 7 Haitians in the crew. They were a total afterthought. It would be insane that if Florian was hesitant to go because of the seas, and only did so because Lisa said it was the only time she could go, that the ship sank because of that. So those Haitian crew member would have died because of her wanting to go that day and now not only are they dead but all the situation surrounding the case revolves around her.

I can't blame the family or the boyfriend or even the authorities but this case was gross from UM. Even from the start, all the talk about the dangers of the Caribbean, it was all in relation to "how dangerous it is too white women americans". To not even show the least concern for the Haitian crew or their families (same to some people in other places and how they talk about the case" was a low point for UM, which unfortunately was common (Ricardo Caputo comes to mind).
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Old 11-09-2018, 10:55 AM   #17
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For whatever reason, I randomly thought about this case a few minutes ago-- it's haunting. It has another "mysterious informant" who claimed that she had secret information about the case. I remember some creepy anonymous calls in some of these episodes from freaks who get a rise from claiming that they know something secret then hang up. Then the update reveals that the victim who the creepy freak claimed was alive and living in ____ died long before the call was made. Based on the fact that the Haitians' families haven't heard anything from their relatives (and even if criminal circumstances were in play here, someone would have heard something from someone by now) I would place the odds at 99% chance that the ship crashed and they're both dead.
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Old 11-09-2018, 11:07 AM   #18
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I suppose my feeling on the eyewitnesses seeing the Freedon after it disappeared could be ranked in order of likelihood:

1. The ship sank prior to the sighting and the eyewitnesses were mistaken about the time period.

2. The ship sank prior to the sighting and the eyewitnesses were lying about the time period, or about the sighting itself.

3. The ship sank after the eyewitness sighting, with some unknown series of events transpiring prior to that time.

3. The eyewitnesses correctly recalled the time period of the sighting, and one or several members of the crew and/or passenger were perhaps overcome in some act of piracy or violence prior to that time.

Think about.. I can't remember the case name, but it was the little red sports car with the license plates of "Lil Miss"

How many people saw that car? And it wound up buried on the property of the guy who killed her all along.

Eyewitnesses are not reliable for the most part. Some are honestly mistaken.. Others are intentionally full of crap to get their 5 minutes of fame or something.
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Old 11-09-2018, 01:15 PM   #19
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Think about.. I can't remember the case name, but it was the little red sports car with the license plates of "Lil Miss"
That was the Lisa Marie Kimmel case, and yes -- I think it is a great example of why you can't always put too much stock in eyewitness accounts.

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Eyewitnesses are not reliable for the most part. Some are honestly mistaken.. Others are intentionally full of crap to get their 5 minutes of fame or something.
I think in most cases, people honestly think they are doing the right thing. The problem is that our memories are not always trustworthy. People can be distracted or focused on the wrong things, so when they try to recall later, their memories are not as clear as they should be. Twenty people can all see the same event, yet have vastly different descriptions of what happened.

As you said, in the Lisa Marie Kimmel case, that sheriff's wife said "I saw that car in that place on that day..." She was sure of it, and yet she was wrong.

I don't doubt all eyewitness testimony, but it has to be taken with a grain of salt, especially if the eyewitness has a motive for their story.
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Old 01-02-2019, 05:44 AM   #20
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Here's a question: Who saw Lisa off that day? Who went to the dock to wave her off?

"on the Morning of the trip she phoned her mother to say goodbye" - Let's Find Them blog

"We had a long discussion the night before she left, that she had to make her own decisions in life, that I couldn't follow her and take care of her wherever she went." - Paul Cornwell, as quoted on the Crime Watchers forum.

"On December 17th, 1988, at 2:30 in the afternoon tugboats eased the Freedom through the Miami River on its way out to sea." - Let's Find Them blog

Is there proof - police records, etc, not the "I'm good friends with an ex tenant of Paul's" kind of 'proof' - that she ever got on the boat in the first place? Could something have happened to her before she even left? Could Lisa and the Freedon be two different mysteries?

Happy to be rebuffed. Just throwing ideas out there.
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Old 01-02-2019, 12:33 PM   #21
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Here's a question: Who saw Lisa off that day? Who went to the dock to wave her off?

"on the Morning of the trip she phoned her mother to say goodbye" - Let's Find Them blog

"We had a long discussion the night before she left, that she had to make her own decisions in life, that I couldn't follow her and take care of her wherever she went." - Paul Cornwell, as quoted on the Crime Watchers forum.

"On December 17th, 1988, at 2:30 in the afternoon tugboats eased the Freedom through the Miami River on its way out to sea." - Let's Find Them blog

Is there proof - police records, etc, not the "I'm good friends with an ex tenant of Paul's" kind of 'proof' - that she ever got on the boat in the first place? Could something have happened to her before she even left? Could Lisa and the Freedon be two different mysteries?

Happy to be rebuffed. Just throwing ideas out there.

This could very well be a possibility (am also happy to be rebuffed), but that would just multiply the mystery. You'd have something happening to Lisa prior to getting to the ship *and* something happening to Florian/the ship/the crew (AFAIK, none have ever been found)
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Old 01-02-2019, 10:30 PM   #22
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Indeed! Would have been unfortunate for Florian - on the off chance that he did do something to Lisa before leaving (say, she decided last minute not to go and he freaked out) - for him and the whole crew to then disappear! "I've got the best alibi! ...oh, hell."
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