Questions Over Homosexuality

[LucyFan]

Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

[JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo]

I'll probably get killed for answering this honestly....

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? yes

b) spiritually immoral? yes

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? No

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? No, i don't belive this. God loves everyone, and anyone can ask for forgiveness for their sins,a nd yes , i think homosexualtiy is a sin cause in the bible it says (this might not be the exact wording) "a man shall not like w/ a man as a woman should, and a woman shall not lie w/ a woman as a man should."

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? There might be a gene that makes a man more femine or vice versa for a woman, but it's free will to choose your sexualtiy, i think.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? yea

[°Bubbly Blonde°]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? 1.) a and b: No
2.) Yes because being gay is something u cant change it's not like being a liar or something.....
3.) No, I believe if you believe in Jesus you can go to heaven personally, and it doesnt matter what sexual orientation u are.
4.) I dont know
5.) No

[InspectorExstead]

Here's my opinion

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? NO

b) spiritually immoral? NO

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? YES. I don't know alot about the Catholic Religion, but I thought everyone was equal in God's eyes, whether you're female or male. So why should you be looked down upon just because of your sexual preferance?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? NO, I don't believe in heaven and hell. Even if I did, the answer would still be no. Homosexuality isn't a "sin" and there's nothing wrong with it.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? NO.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Yes.

[Chocoholic]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

I don't think homosexuality is wrong or immoral at all. I'll let God be the judge.

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

Yes, because it is hypocritical of them. Jesus taught us to love thy neighbor and not to judge other people.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

I think anyone who lets Jesus into their life goes to Heaven.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

I honestly don't know. I think people are born gay.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

No, I don't think we have control over who we love.

[pandora_spocks]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? NO

b) spiritually immoral? NO

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

YES! Just because they're homosexual doesn't mean that they don't have feelings like everyone else. Does the catholic church look down on people because of their race or because they have a disability? That was the card those people were dealt and homosexuality is the card that homosexuals got dealt.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

NO and if they are then I'd rather go to hell. Seriously, we're all people like I said before - do people with disabilities or those who happen to be a different color go to hell and not heaven? That would be stupid if they did because their just people like homosexuals are.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

Absolutely not! Having feelings for the same sex isn't a 'gene' it's just life, I believe homosexuals are born that way it's not gene. I should know this because I have always felt different my whole life and although it took me quite a long time to realize it I never understood why I felt different. Even at a younger age I still felt distant from those around me because I wasn't interested in any of the things that the people around me were interested in. In this case, it was boys. I was never really interested in them, but afraid of what people might think I hid my feelings brainwashing myself for awhile too, but you'd have to know my whole life story to understand.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

No, and people don't get to choose who they love and who get to love them back either.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

1. No, not per se--I would think that if something were immoral, it would make no difference if it were "spiritually" immoral or otherwise.

2. I believe it is wrong for any Christian church to look down on homosexuality--in particular the Catholic Church, because its views go back to a pre-Medieval view of sexuality from St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and Tertullian who believed that "women were the gateways into hell", and of course Augustine's view that the way God punished us in the Garden of Eden was--by giving us sexual desire!:eek: Since my views on homosexuality are shaped by the autobiography of Mel White, gay Christian author of "Stranger At the Gate", it is hard for me to endorse anymore that homosexuals are evil.

3. Many of the "proof-texts" used to oppose homosexuality refer to something else entirely: i.e., the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, where the citizens of the two cities were condemned for the sin of their lack of hospitality. People find it easy to use the Bible to justify their condemnation for things they find distasteful, but many warnings and "laws" in the Bible and in the Mosaic Old Testament have no bearing on our lives and society today. Is it wrong to eat pork or shellfish? According to the Old Testament, it is. Maybe this doesn't have much to do with homosexuality, but remember that the Bible was written long before modern sciences and psychology gave us understanding of human nature.

4. "Gay gene"? Not sure.

5. Of course we have control over our sexual feelings. But if you mean we can just "switch" to being strictly straight when we're predisposed to being gay, welllllllll.....I'd like to see how you can try. I believe so many "ex-gays" are going through that craziness right now, kicking the "gay habit" not so much for themselves, but more to gain respect from homophobic persons in society.

[LucyFan]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?



1-
a) I really don't know. I feel as though it shouldn't be immoral because we should be allowed to choose whoever we want to be with regardless who they are, their race, their gender, their background, ect.

b) I've been taught it's immoral. I do believe it but then I have other beliefs that contradict it. It's really confusing.

2- I think The Catholic Church does have a right to look down on it because their source, The Bible, basically says it is wrong. And according to the Bible, our creator was and is God. With that said, The Bibles tells us that God never intended for homosexuality to come about, nor it wasn't apart of his design for sexual desire.

3- I really don't know. I have heard that God condems those who purposely have sex with their own gender. I've also heard that God forgives not matter what the problem is.

4- I don't know. It may be possible since we find a lot of people in history to be homosexuals and we still have them today.

5- I think a minority of people are born natually to have sexual feelings for a particular gender [sexually wise].

[Tuesday Weld]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

a) No

b) No

2)Yes,because it shouldn't be considered a sin.

3)No,I don't think God punishes people for their sexual preference.

4) Maybe,I don't know.

5) I think most people do not have control over who they love.However,I think there are some who just want to experiment or feel that they are different.

[Kristina]

I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? NO

b) spiritually immoral? NO

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

Yes I do, religious people have a rep for being good being PREJUDICE is evil. People need to be more accepting. WHAT THE WORLD NEEDS NOW IS LOVE, SWEET LOVE.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

NO. If a homosexual is a good person, as an not a killer, then they are not a bad person. Just because they are attracted to a member of the same sex that means they are bad people? HELL NO!

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

Yes, I do. There's nothing abnormal about it, it's just as normal as a boy liking a girl and a girl liking a boy.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

No, you can't change how you feel.

[Czas na Zywiec]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? Absolutely not.

b) spiritually immoral? Same as above.

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

It's hipocritical because they preach that you should love your neighbor like yourself, and then they go around saying "Except gay and lesbian people." Yea, yea, there's that one quote in the bible that it says not to lie down with another man or woman, but that just contradicts this one. And vice-versa. So whish is it? It's not strictly the Catholic Church though, a lot of other churches say this. And a lot of Catholics (As well as other religions), like myself, don't agree.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

No, they have done nothing wrong. You can't change the way you feel about loving a person. Remember, it's all on the inside. You fall in love with a person because of their soul, not just because of their gender. Because in the end, when you do die, that's all you are, a soul.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

No. And not all homosexual people follow the general 'feminie' or 'butch' type of person. That usually happens if you're born with an unusual amount of testosterone or estrogen.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

Like I said before, you can't control the way you feel. Say you like chocolate. You're not going to turn away from if just because a lot of other people say it's a sin, do you? Far fetched example, but it's the same, basic idea.

[ILuvJoandBlair]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?
Personally yes

b) spiritually immoral?
don't know

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

-it shouldn't be seeing as there are a lot of homeosexuals in the church.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

-No, because your sexual orientation does not determine if you go to heaven or hell, your belief in God does.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

-No, reason.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

-No, no one can controll who they have sexual feelings for, it just happens.

[¤I Love Clay Aiken¤]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? No

b) spiritually immoral? No

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? Yes. Well, Im not Catholic but I dont like how religions look down upon ones beliefs.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? If that person is gay and also believes that being gay will bring them into hell, then yes. But I, personally, dont think God would punish someone for who they are if they asked for forgiveness.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? No!!! Is there such thing as a "straight" gene?:rolleyes:

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? No. You can hide how you feel, but you cannot control who you are. Im straight and I cant "make myself gay."

[fr00ti]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? no

b) spiritually immoral? no

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? Yeah because that makes it seem to people in the church that every homosexual is bad, and thats definitely not true.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? No because I think that If you believe in god and are saved you will go to heaven.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? No.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? No, because I'm physically attracted to girls and im a girl, and i didnt choose one or the other, thats just what my feelings are. You dont have any control over it.

[Christopher]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? No, people should be able to love who ever they want to.

b) spiritually immoral? No

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? Yes it is wrong. I don't care what you members think, but if you believe in God then you know he doesn't hate his children if they are gay or not. So them hating gays, looking down on them, that shows me they don't believe or follow God. JMO

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? All they do is fall in love with some one in the same sex so they are going to hell for that? God wouldn't do that. You're not going to hell just for that.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? No.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? I don't think anyone has control over their sexual feelings I guess. I don't know.

[Faith]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?


1. I don't think that homosexuality is immoral spiritually or in any other way.

2. Yes it is wrong for the Catholic Church to look down on anyone because of their sexuality, just like it is for anyone else to.

3. Nope, don't believe in heaven or hell.

4. Never really thought about it.

5. No, I think that if a person does try to control or hide their feelings about their sexuality then the only person they are not being true to, is themselves.

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by LucyFan
2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

Didn't I tell myself I'd never talk about religion on messages boards? Ugh, oh well, it's just the internet and I don't care.

Why are you secluding the Catholic Church? All Christian denominations seem to have a problem with it. Even the Pope came out a few years ago and said people are born homosexual, they can't help it, and their parents should not shun them. Still, I know what you mean by question 2, and that's all I have to say about it.

[Crimson and Clover]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

1. A an B: NO
2. I think its wrong, but hey everybody has their own opinions.
3. I dont believe in heaven or hell.
4. Ive never really thought about it. I guess its poosible but not very likely
5. No,you cant help who you fall in love with.

[*PinkLady*]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? No

b) spiritually immoral? No

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? Yes, because it's a form of discrimination.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? No. I don't see any reason why they would be condemned.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? No.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? No, because most people would choose to be straight because it's more "normal" in society. You can't help your sexual preferences.

[Kay Scarpetta]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? no

b) spiritually immoral? no

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? Yes. We are all people. We are all of the same damn species. Who cares if you're a girl and you love girls? Visa versa with men. People shouldn't care.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? No. See above answer. I mean good God, (no pun intended), if that's what they base your destination on, then Hell's going to be one full place.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? Nope. This relates to a great argument that I had in my psychology class today. Nature vs. Nurtured. You don't have a "gay" gene passed on to you, just like I believe that everyone is nurtured, growing up on their own. Sure, parents and adults have influence on you, but who you grow up to be depends solely on yourself.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? No. I just don't think you can help it

[ABlairican Pie]

Funny how Catholics think they're in this glorious position to dictate people's love and sexual lives when they're up to their ass in alligators over pedophile priests.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw breadcrumbs. ;)

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica
Funny how Catholics think they're in this glorious position to dictate people's love and sexual lives when they're up to their ass in alligators over pedophile priests.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw breadcrumbs. ;)

:lol:

I don't think there's even enough homosexual couples on tv. I mean what's up with that? We're people too, damn it! :p

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo
I'll probably get killed for answering this honestly....

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? yes

b) spiritually immoral? yes

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? No

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? No, i don't belive this. God loves everyone, and anyone can ask for forgiveness for their sins,a nd yes , i think homosexualtiy is a sin cause in the bible it says (this might not be the exact wording) "a man shall not like w/ a man as a woman should, and a woman shall not lie w/ a woman as a man should."

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? There might be a gene that makes a man more femine or vice versa for a woman, but it's free will to choose your sexualtiy, i think.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? yea



I agree with everything you said.

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Three'sCompanyrules

I agree with everything you said.

Well, I don't. I'm not trying to start a fight, but I don't see how religious people or not can't be open minded. I might be a lesbian myself, but at least I'm open minded to everyone else. I mean I'm not going around saying that straight people are bad like they do to homosexuals. Homophobia is nothing, but pure ignorance for the human race. How can you hate something which you know nothing about? Everyone on this board must have something about them that they'd hate for anyone to make fun of or discriminate against them for. I just don't understand why people can't open up to the fact that everyone is different in one way or another. I don't care how religious you are, but still homosexuals are people and we have feelings too. This is just my opinion, but I think most homophobia comes from those who are just afraid they might be gay themselves, therefore they make fun of homosexuals to retain their 'straight' profile.

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by pandora_spocks


Well, I don't. I'm not trying to start a fight, but I don't see how religious people or not can't be open minded. I might be a lesbian myself, but at least I'm open minded to everyone else. I mean I'm not going around saying that straight people are bad like they do to homosexuals. Homophobia is nothing, but pure ignorance for the human race. How can you hate something which you know nothing about? Everyone on this board must have something about them that they'd hate for anyone to make fun of or discriminate against them for. I just don't understand why people can't open up to the fact that everyone is different in one way or another. I don't care how religious you are, but still homosexuals are people and we have feelings too. This is just my opinion, but I think most homophobia comes from those who are just afraid they might be gay themselves, therefore they make fun of homosexuals to retain their 'straight' profile.

Well this is how I look at it, I believe it is wrong, and that won't change for me, but I can tell you I don't hate people for who they are as long as they are good people, I may not agree with it, but I'm not going to put anybody down for who they are, that is wrong, and it bugs me when people make fun of other people for what they do or who they are. Yes I'm a religous person, but I don't put anyone down for the things they do or the descisions they make its there choice not mine or anybody elses. I hope I don't offend anyone, but thats how I feel about it. I feel its wrong and thats the way I was brought up. I think you are a nice person. Again I think its wrong, but I will never put a person down for who they are.

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Three'sCompanyrules


Well this is how I look at it, I believe it is wrong, and that won't change for me, but I can tell you I don't hate people for who they are as long as they are good people, I may not agree with it, but I'm not going to put anybody down for who they are, that is wrong, and it bugs me when people make fun of other people for what they do or who they are. Yes I'm a religous person, but I don't put anyone down for the things they do or the descisions they make its there choice not mine or anybody elses. I hope I don't offend anyone, but thats how I feel about it. I feel its wrong and thats the way I was brought up. I think you are a nice person. Again I think its wrong, but I will never put a person down for who they are.

Homosexuality isn't a choice. I never woke up one morning and said to myself, 'Hey, I think I'll be a lesbian!' That's not how it works. It was the card I was dealt so I happen to like girls, big deal. I'm not hurting or killing anyone by being this way so why should it be wrong? Killing, raping, and discrimination is wrong. Just because a person happens to be slightly different from you, you think it's wrong. Hello, wake up, people are gonna be different, it's the way of the world. It's the same thing with religion if a person happens to be a different religion, which I also happen to be because I'm a wiccan, you automatically think I'm wrong for being in a different religion. Maybe this is why I want out of this world so bad because I can't stand how people can say things like homosexuality is wrong and not see that there are far more important things to be concerned with.

Tell me something, do you think being a different color is wrong? Or perhaps someone being disabled? I know I shouldn't compare these things, but in some cases it makes those people different. There's nothing you can do to change how they are like you can't change how homosexuals are. I'm not trying to preach because I don't believe in that either. I'm just giving my opinion and frankly I don't care if anyone agrees with me or not. I too was brought up to hate homosexuals, anyone with a different color than white, and so on, but luckily I took charge of my own mind and decided being brought up like that was just wrong. I think for myself and I'm glad at least I know I have an open mind about these things.

You'll have to forgive me, but I just can't see how you see that it's wrong and I certainly hope you don't think killing and raping is right because those are things people should be more concered with than instead of worrying about if someone is sleeping with the same sex. Frankly, I don't think that's anyone elses business anyway.

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by pandora_spocks


Homosexuality isn't a choice. I never woke up one morning and said to myself, 'Hey, I think I'll be a lesbian!' That's not how it works. It was the card I was dealt so I happen to like girls, big deal. I'm not hurting or killing anyone by being this way so why should it be wrong? Killing, raping, and discrimination is wrong. Just because a person happens to be slightly different from you, you think it's wrong. Hello, wake up, people are gonna be different, it's the way of the world. It's the same thing with religion if a person happens to be a different religion, which I also happen to be because I'm a wiccan, you automatically think I'm wrong for being in a different religion. Maybe this is why I want out of this world so bad because I can't stand how people can say things like homosexuality is wrong and not see that there are far more important things to be concerned with.

Tell me something, do you think being a different color is wrong? Or perhaps someone being disabled? I know I shouldn't compare these things, but in some cases it makes those people different. There's nothing you can do to change how they are like you can't change how homosexuals are. I'm not trying to preach because I don't believe in that either. I'm just giving my opinion and frankly I don't care if anyone agrees with me or not. I too was brought up to hate homosexuals, anyone with a different color than white, and so on, but luckily I took charge of my own mind and decided being brought up like that was just wrong. I think for myself and I'm glad at least I know I have an open mind about these things.

You'll have to forgive me, but I just can't see how you see that it's wrong and I certainly hope you don't think killing and raping is right because those are things people should be more concered with than instead of worrying about if someone is sleeping with the same sex. Frankly, I don't think that's anyone elses business anyway.


No I don't think being a different color is wrong at all, I like people of all races, in fact one of my neighbors is African American. I also work with kids who have disabilities and I enjoy that very much, in fact one of my friends has down syndrome. I wasn't brought up to hate anybody. and like I said I wouldn't have a problem with a gay person if they were nice and friendly. I was wrong in saying its a choice. I don't think killing someone or raping someone is right at all, and people who do those things should be punished, and in most cases punsihed with the death penalty. I hope I didn't offend you or anybody else. You are right it is nobodys business what a person does, and believe me I have alot of bigger concerns then what someones preferences are. I know being homosexual isn't a crime, but I was brought up that it is wrong and that it should be a man and a women, but like you said its nobodys business anyway, and I will say it again even though I disagree with it, I don't hate anybody for who they are. I'm sorry if I offended you.

[ABlairican Pie]

I've just noticed something, Three'sCompanyrules believes homosexuality to be wrong, and, as I've noticed, has rather conservative views. Isn't it strange, though, that he/she has a username based on one of the most liberal shows of the 70's whose theme was about tolerant sexuality--and was accused of being "jiggle television".:idea:

Homosexuality is wrong, yada yada yada, we say, because we as heterosexuals cringe over the thought of two gay guys doing whatever...:eek: But what do you think gay people think about straight people doing the deal, does it not give THEM the creeps? (I'm wondering if gays think of the opposite gender's sexual organs as being "icky" or scary...)

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Three'sCompanyrules



No I don't think being a different color is wrong at all, I like people of all races, in fact one of my neighbors is African American. I also work with kids who have disabilities and I enjoy that very much, in fact one of my friends has down syndrome. I wasn't brought up to hate anybody. and like I said I wouldn't have a problem with a gay person if they were nice and friendly. I was wrong in saying its a choice. I don't think killing someone or raping someone is right at all, and people who do those things should be punished, and in most cases punsihed with the death penalty. I hope I didn't offend you or anybody else. You are right it is nobodys business what a person does, and believe me I have alot of bigger concerns then what someones preferences are. I know being homosexual isn't a crime, but I was brought up that it is wrong and that it should be a man and a women, but like you said its nobodys business anyway, and I will say it again even though I disagree with it, I don't hate anybody for who they are. I'm sorry if I offended you.

You didn't offended me I'm just stating my case that's all. I mean you were on here saying that how my life is wrong. I didn't take offense, but I wanted to react for maybe those who would be afraid to. I too was brought up in a home where I'm supposed to hate gays, anyone with a different color than white, and god knows what else. I just decided not to listen to my parents and think for myself over these matters. I mean I have a gay uncle too, and lets face it my family really doesn't like him, but after I told my mom that I was then she started to loosen up about the whole thing and realized I'm still the same person. My brother knew before she did - in fact he was the first to know. He didn't care, still doesn't. My dad is idiot lol..I've said it hundreds of times in front of him he gets this glazed look in his eyes then a minute later returns on his merry way. He never noticed me much anyway so I don't care what he thinks.

As for what Captain ABlairica said, that is a very good question about you saying homosexuals are wrong when you're such a big fan of 'Three's Company.' I don't know why your screen name didn't sink in earlier.

Captain ABlairica, it doesn't bother me to see straight people kiss or anything. I don't hate men - just the ones like my father and the kind who think they can get anyway with anything, rape, murder, having their way with any and every woman. To be honest, I hanged out with the boys in high school more because I had nothing in common with the girls. Oh, and no I don't think their bodily parts are disgusting, for pete's sake, I watch 'Queer As Folk,' that show is full of'em.

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by pandora_spocks


You didn't offended me I'm just stating my case that's all. I mean you were on here saying that how my life is wrong. I didn't take offense, but I wanted to react for maybe those who would be afraid to. I too was brought up in a home where I'm supposed to hate gays, anyone with a different color than white, and god knows what else. I just decided not to listen to my parents and think for myself over these matters. I mean I have a gay uncle too, and lets face it my family really doesn't like him, but after I told my mom that I was then she started to loosen up about the whole thing and realized I'm still the same person. My brother knew before she did - in fact he was the first to know. He didn't care, still doesn't. My dad is idiot lol..I've said it hundreds of times in front of him he gets this glazed look in his eyes then a minute later returns on his merry way. He never noticed me much anyway so I don't care what he thinks.

As for what Captain ABlairica said, that is a very good question about you saying homosexuals are wrong when you're such a big fan of 'Three's Company.' I don't know why your screen name didn't sink in earlier.

Captain ABlairica, it doesn't bother me to see straight people kiss or anything. I don't hate men - just the ones like my father and the kind who think they can get anyway with anything, rape, murder, having their way with any and every woman. To be honest, I hanged out with the boys in high school more because I had nothing in common with the girls. Oh, and no I don't think their bodily parts are disgusting, for pete's sake, I watch 'Queer As Folk,' that show is full of'em.


Well let me put it this way I belive that homosexuality is a sin as it says in the Bible, but nobody is going to go to hell for it as long as they believe in the lord, heck if Saddam Huessain asked the lord into his life then he will be in heaven, I don't know if he did or not, but you never know. I remeber a teacher of mine saying once that what a person does in there own time is there business and nobody elses.

Like I said before I may not agree with it, but I absoulutly don't hate anybody for who they are and what there preferences are, and its a shame that people get angry about it, or think they have to hurt people who a different then they are, its those people who are sick. I don't know you that well, but you seem like a cool person and I enjoy reading your posts. This is a crazy world we live in. I may not seem open about it because I don't know anbody personaly who is homosexual, so its hard for me to understand exactaly what there preferences are so to speak. I don't know if I isaid that right, but I hope you know what I mean.

As far as the Three's Company thing goes, first of all I am a Guy. I like the show for its humor, I don't agree with there living style, but its intersting to say the least, its just like I like All in the Family for the humor, and I agree with Archie on his political views, but I don't agree with Archie on how he treats other races and homosexuals and other religions.

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Three'sCompanyrules



Well let me put it this way I belive that homosexuality is a sin as it says in the Bible, but nobody is going to go to hell for it as long as they believe in the lord, heck if Saddam Huessain asked the lord into his life then he will be in heaven, I don't know if he did or not, but you never know. I remeber a teacher of mine saying once that what a person does in there own time is there business and nobody elses.

Like I said before I may not agree with it, but I absoulutly don't hate anybody for who they are and what there preferences are, and its a shame that people get angry about it, or think they have to hurt people who a different then they are, its those people who are sick. I don't know you that well, but you seem like a cool person and I enjoy reading your posts. This is a crazy world we live in. I may not seem open about it because I don't know anbody personaly who is homosexual, so its hard for me to understand exactaly what there preferences are so to speak. I don't know if I isaid that right, but I hope you know what I mean.

As far as the Three's Company thing goes, first of all I am a Guy. I like the show for its humor, I don't agree with there living style, but its intersting to say the least, its just like I like All in the Family for the humor, and I agree with Archie on his political views, but I don't agree with Archie on how he treats other races and homosexuals and other religions.

Forgive me, for saying this because I know a lot of people on here are gonna hate me for saying it, but I don't care if homosexuality is stated or not in the bible as a sin or not. I live my own life and I don't practice religions surrounded entirely by the bible. It's not a sin otherwise, everything else in the world we do would be a sin too. I don't base my whole life on a book that means nothing to me. Frankly, I'm in hell as far as home goes and my mom feels the same way. I don't think there is a hell out of this life just what we make of life in this world.
Why can't this world just get along with everyone and maybe we wouldn't have so much freakin' chaos. I don't understand why it's okay for straight people to be straight and think we're the weird ones. Maybe we think you straight people are weird. I don't, I'm just trying to make a point. I don't care anymore I know I'm not gonna change your views or anyone elses. I'm just trying to get you to maybe see how I see it so you see that we're not sinning we're just living our lives the way they were handed to us. And frankly, I'll be honest I hate this world with all it's high-end fashions, the rich and the poor, and famine. This world is too full of flaws even for me maybe thats why I constantly want out of it so I don't have to turn on the news and see that more people are dead from terrorists, rapings, murders, and god knows what else. I myself don't fit into this cookie cutter world and I never will and probably will never want to.

Someone cut me a record deal so I can start rapping about this horrible world. :p

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by pandora_spocks


Forgive me, for saying this because I know a lot of people on here are gonna hate me for saying it, but I don't care if homosexuality is stated or not in the bible as a sin or not. I live my own life and I don't practice religions surrounded entirely by the bible. It's not a sin otherwise, everything else in the world we do would be a sin too. I don't base my whole life on a book that means nothing to me. Frankly, I'm in hell as far as home goes and my mom feels the same way. I don't think there is a hell out of this life just what we make of life in this world.
Why can't this world just get along with everyone and maybe we wouldn't have so much freakin' chaos. I don't understand why it's okay for straight people to be straight and think we're the weird ones. Maybe we think you straight people are weird. I don't, I'm just trying to make a point. I don't care anymore I know I'm not gonna change your views or anyone elses. I'm just trying to get you to maybe see how I see it so you see that we're not sinning we're just living our lives the way they were handed to us. And frankly, I'll be honest I hate this world with all it's high-end fashions, the rich and the poor, and famine. This world is too full of flaws even for me maybe thats why I constantly want out of it so I don't have to turn on the news and see that more people are dead from terrorists, rapings, murders, and god knows what else. I myself don't fit into this cookie cutter world and I never will and probably will never want to.

Someone cut me a record deal so I can start rapping about this horrible world. :p

I don't hate you for what you said, after all everyone has the right to believe what they want, I just hate that people are judgmental about these things, You are right this is a dangerous world we live in and sadly its probably going to get worse. I don't think gay people are wierd, like people make them out to be, like you said people are people and we all have feelings. You are right you proably wont change my views, but I just want you that I don't hate anybody. I respect your views and opinions, and though it won't probably change my views, you did make me think a bit moore on how to look at things.

[Czas na Zywiec]

Originally posted by Three'sCompanyrules



Well let me put it this way I belive that homosexuality is a sin as it says in the Bible

I respect your opinion and I too am religious, but doesn't the Bible also state "Love your neighbor like thy self"?

Also, think about when the Bible was written. In a time where there were few people on earth, little or sometimes no medication, and no technology. How could people back then have possibly known the complex structure of the human persona? People of different race used to be enslaved and houses and churches used to be burned down by people, but look at us today. Why did the racism stop? (I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I am not a racist.) Hopefully one day, people will reach a point and realize it's ridiculous to cast out people because of their sexual orientation. I thought that those kind of matters should stay within yourself or in your home.

[Montclave]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

The homosexuality act is immoral. The person, themself, is only immoral if they perform the act.

b) spiritually immoral? Same as above.

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

The Catholic Church and Christians, who follow the bible, look down upon perverse acts, not a person who abstains from perverse acts.


3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

There are several references in the bible regarding this issue. One to note in leviticus 28:22 states "You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. Also Cor. 6: 9,10 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God," Paul wrote, "do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor drunkards, nor homosexuals…shall inherit the kingdom of God"


4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

Not sure?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

Yes.

[pandora_spocks]

Not offending anyone just asking a simple question. I've noticed a lot of people just answer 'Yes' to the questions without stating why they feel that way. I mean LucyFan specifically asks 'Why or why not?' I mean why even post if you're not gonna give us an explaination to why you think that. Especially, when people say yes. I mean I would sure like to know why you feel that way because I'm one of the ones you're offending here.

[JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo]

I don't mean to start anything. But i personally belive homosexualtiy is wrong. Why? CAuse that's what I belive. The bible clearly states that it's wrong. If you don't belive in the Bible or don't want to live your life around following the word of the Bible, that's fine. That's between you and God or whoever it is you belive in. As far as me being called homophobic and close-minded, tha'ts fine, if you would like to think that simply because my opions are different from yours, that's fine. Think what you will. Never once did I say people who are homosexual deserve to be discriminated against or made fun of, i just don't agree w/ the way they live. They may not agree w/ the way I live. That's part of our rights, live the way we wanna live. That's all i'm gonna say. As far as people being born homosexual, i don't belive that, once again, because of my religious beliefs. God created us, and in the Bible he clearly states it's wrong.

[JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo]

Originally posted by Original Prankster


I respect your opinion and I too am religious, but doesn't the Bible also state "Love your neighbor like thy self"?


You can "love thy neighbor" and disagree w/ them at the same time.

[Czas na Zywiec]

Originally posted by JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo


You can "love thy neighbor" and disagree w/ them at the same time.

Yes, but you don't condemn to hell if you do. Now saying you said that, but a few people have.

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo
I don't mean to start anything. But i personally belive homosexualtiy is wrong. Why? CAuse that's what I belive. The bible clearly states that it's wrong. If you don't belive in the Bible or don't want to live your life around following the word of the Bible, that's fine. That's between you and God or whoever it is you belive in. As far as me being called homophobic and close-minded, tha'ts fine, if you would like to think that simply because my opions are different from yours, that's fine. Think what you will. Never once did I say people who are homosexual deserve to be discriminated against or made fun of, i just don't agree w/ the way they live. They may not agree w/ the way I live. That's part of our rights, live the way we wanna live. That's all i'm gonna say. As far as people being born homosexual, i don't belive that, once again, because of my religious beliefs. God created us, and in the Bible he clearly states it's wrong.

I never said you or anyone else on this board had to agree with me. I'm just saying that I don't see how you can think it's wrong. You may not understand how 'we' live, but that doesn't mean you have to say it's wrong just because we're not screwing the opposite sex like you are and I mean all straight people that wasn't really directed towards you. Frankly, I'd rather be with a girl in an intimate way rather than a boy, big deal. So if you think it's wrong, fine I don't care. You believe what you want to believe. I'm open minded enough not to go around and say that straight people are wrong and what they do is a sin, but see how easily I can twist the words around.

[JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo]

Originally posted by Original Prankster


Yes, but you don't condemn to hell if you do. Now saying you said that, but a few people have.

well those few people that have are wrong. No human has the right to condemn anyone to hell over anything, no matter how severe they think it is.

[Brandon]

1.Do you think homosexuality is:

plain immoral - no...
spiritually immoral - no...

2. Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

YES! it's so stupid... it's very dumb to me...

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemned into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

Hell no! I don't even believe in hell...

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

Haha! Maybe...

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

No. Absolute no control.... I know I don't

[Three'sCompanyrules]

Originally posted by JoJoJoJoJoJoJoJoJo
I don't mean to start anything. But i personally belive homosexualtiy is wrong. Why? CAuse that's what I belive. The bible clearly states that it's wrong. If you don't belive in the Bible or don't want to live your life around following the word of the Bible, that's fine. That's between you and God or whoever it is you belive in. As far as me being called homophobic and close-minded, tha'ts fine, if you would like to think that simply because my opions are different from yours, that's fine. Think what you will. Never once did I say people who are homosexual deserve to be discriminated against or made fun of, i just don't agree w/ the way they live. They may not agree w/ the way I live. That's part of our rights, live the way we wanna live. That's all i'm gonna say. As far as people being born homosexual, i don't belive that, once again, because of my religious beliefs. God created us, and in the Bible he clearly states it's wrong.


I agree with what you said and that is the way I feel about it also.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Montclave
1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

The homosexuality act is immoral. The person, themself, is only immoral if they perform the act.

b) spiritually immoral? Same as above.

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

The Catholic Church and Christians, who follow the bible, look down upon perverse acts, not a person who abstains from perverse acts.


3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

There are several references in the bible regarding this issue. One to note in leviticus 28:22 states "You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. Also Cor. 6: 9,10 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God," Paul wrote, "do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor drunkards, nor homosexuals…shall inherit the kingdom of God"


4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

Not sure?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

Yes.

Let me get this straight (no pun intended), Senator Santorum:
We have no beef (no pun intended) with a person who is gay as long as they don't act on they're being gay. So they can buy those charming pink chiffon curtains, and nifty flowery china dinner plates (oh, how gay!! They're acting on their gayness again!!), which is okay, prolly...in order to impress that charming
stud they met at that oh-so-gay dating service, Boys R Us...which in all likelihood after dinner and a movie, they are gonna do..GAY LOVIN' STUFF...:eek: Okay, is it Biblically immoral for ohh, say, a
gay couple to...hold hands?:love: Or how about...kissy-kissy?:kiss: So when they get all hot and bothered, and slooowwwwly edge their way to First Base, that's when that whole Wrath of God clause comes in...

See, the problem is that in the minds of most Christians, there is no difference between the sin and the idea which leads to the sin.
All of us have sexual fantasies. Is it wrong for gay people to THINK about doing it with someone they like? Even Christians have fantasies, too, believe it or not. Just because Jesus says lust is just as bad as the actual act, doesn't stop us one bit.

Btw, killing off pagan tribes in the name of the Lord is totally Biblical.

[Unwanted Angel]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

A and B-NO!!!!

2-I can't really answer that one.

3-No! I believe that God loves all of his children and i believe if you believe in him you go to Heaven...I don't know if its true but its what i believe.

4-No...

5-No! you can not help who you fall in love with, Its in the heart.

JMO.

[Mossopp]

I was gonna stay out of this thread because everyone knows where I stand on this whole issue but I'm bored right now so I may aswell add my 2 cents...

Originally posted by LucyFan

1) Do you think homosexuality is
a) plain immoral (wrong)?
b) spiritually immoral?

I don't think it's immoral in anyway, shape or form. Immorality is defined in the dictionary as "evil" or "depraved" and being gay is neither of these things.

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

Don't even get me started on the catholic church! :mad: Their ideas and entire belief structure is several centuries out of date! It's one thing to be homophobic and simply state that you hate gay people. But it's a whole different story when you try and hide your homophobia behind a mask of religion. That's nothing but cowardice! Make up your own mind - don't let some book tell you what to think!
I also take issue with people quoting the bible at me. Why do they think that reciting bible passages to me is gonna "turn" me straight? It simply shows the level of ignorance we are dealing with here. The bible means nothing to me so quoting it at me will make no impact.
Secondly, the bible may say that homosexuality is a sin but it also says "let he who is without sin cast the first stone". Therefor anyone out there who has never done anything wrong in their entire life is more than welcome to judge me................but I doubt that there are many of you.

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

I don't believe in heaven or hell (not in the way they are portrayed in the bible, anyway). Heaven and Hell is are states of mind. I believe that when I die I'll go to heaven cos I've already spent my time in hell.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

To be honest I don't know.
I am friends with 2 guys. They are identical twins, born 20 minutes apart. One of them is a total lad - always chasing the ladies, getting drunk, playing rugby - total player. The other is the exact opposite - really sweet, sensitive, likes singing in the choir, doing origami - he is also gay. These 2 guys are identical twins so surely their genetic make-up is exactly the same? So why is one gay and the other is straight? Surely this is pretty strong evidence that there is no such thing as a "gay gene"?
But if there really were no such thing as a "gay gene" then that would imply that being gay is not pre-determined and that, if a gay person really wanted to, they could "turn" themselves straight.
Being gay myself, I know that it is not possible to "turn" yourself but I'm still not conviced if there really is such a thing as a gay gene. I mean, where does it come from? Genetic traits are passed on through the parents but all gay people come from heterosexual parents so where is this so-called "gay gene" originating from??
I don't know. I try not to think about it to be honest. For me, debating on where homosexuality in a person originates from is too much like questioning my own existance and it scares me.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

No, I don't. For no other reason that the fact that I know how I feel and I know there is no way I could ever change that.

[pandora_spocks]

Originally posted by Mossopp
Don't even get me started on the catholic church! Their ideas and entire belief structure is several centuries out of date! It's one thing to be homophobic and simply state that you hate gay people. But it's a whole different story when you try and hide your homophobia behind a mask of religion. That's nothing but cowardice! Make up your own mind - don't let some book tell you what to think!
I also take issue with people quoting the bible at me. Why do they think that reciting bible passages to me is gonna "turn" me straight? It simply shows the level of ignorance we are dealing with here. The bible means nothing to me so quoting it at me will make no impact.
Secondly, the bible may say that homosexuality is a sin but it also says "let he who is without sin cast the first stone". Therefor anyone out there who has never done anything wrong in their entire life is more than welcome to judge me................but I doubt that there are many of you.


Thank you! :clap:
I was trying to say that all along about the religion stuff. So spouting bible stuff to me isn't gonna change me either so don't even try it. 'Cause all you'll get is one of these :rolleyes:. Frankly, you can say I'm going to hell all you want, but not even hell itself is as bad as living with my father.

Again, well said Mossopp. I'm glad there's someone like you who can say these things better than I can. :)

[Cashodeen]

I love how many non-Catholic Christians think the Catholics are cracked or not EVEN christian, even though Catholism was the first formed Christian religion. When I tell people I was raised Catholic, they ask me, "Oh so you're not Christian?" (I'd be very rich if I had a nickel everytime some "born again" type asked me that.)

Yet, when it comes to questions of homosexuality, Catholics are the ring leaders for the homophobic beings that believe in God. I just wish question 2 was worded differently. I know plenty of Protestant people (many living in that bible belt down south) that are the worst condenmers of homosexuality I've ever seen. But yes, I must stress MANY Catholics are terrible too. And I think it stinks. If their is such a thing as "liberal Catholics," many of my family is that, thank GOD. We were pleased when the Pope finally came out and stopped being so ruthless on people who are gay (check out my last post.) I don't hear Protestant ministers lightening up on the subject. Still, I agree with those of you who think The Catholic Church is wrong with continuing to be so hard on homosexuality. They still are far too wrong. I think they are wrong with other things to besides homosexuality. And I don't think God will strike me down because I'm Catholic yet I disagree with several HUGE things the Church says.

People who are gay are not deviant, they're not going to hell because they're gay or because they have relationships. And no, people who are gay cannot turn themselves straight. PLEASE. And whatever the bible says on the matter, I don't care. Do you know plenty of passages in the bible exist, that many don't know about and so they aren't following them? My favorite example is that "women need to wear a veil everytime they pray because they aren't as good as men." Did you know the bible said that? Did you all? Do all you gals out there pray with a veil over your head? Well, you'd better start because the bible says so.

I love what Captain ABlairica had to say. Many of you have made really valid points. Just please don't forget, other Christian religions are bassakwards too. But Catholics are certainly the most vocal, so I guess I should expect they would be isolated.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
I love how many non-Catholic Christians think the Catholics are cracked or not EVEN christian, even though Catholism was the first formed Christian religion. When I tell people I was raised Catholic, they ask me, "Oh so you're not Christian?" (I'd be very rich if I had a nickel everytime some "born again" type asked me that.)

Yet, when it comes to questions of homosexuality, Catholics are the ring leaders for the homophobic beings that believe in God. I just wish question 2 was worded differently. I know plenty of Protestant people (many living in that bible belt down south) that are the worst condenmers of homosexuality I've ever seen. But yes, I must stress MANY Catholics are terrible too. And I think it stinks. If their is such a thing as "liberal Catholics," many of my family is that, thank GOD. We were pleased when the Pope finally came out and stopped being so ruthless on people who are gay (check out my last post.) I don't hear Protestant ministers lightening up on the subject. Still, I agree with those of you who think The Catholic Church is wrong with continuing to be so hard on homosexuality. They still are far too wrong. I think they are wrong with other things to besides homosexuality. And I don't think God will strike me down because I'm Catholic yet I disagree with several HUGE things the Church says.

People who are gay are not deviant, they're not going to hell because they're gay or because they have relationships. And no, people who are gay cannot turn themselves straight. PLEASE. And whatever the bible says on the matter, I don't care. Do you know plenty of passages in the bible exist, that many don't know about and so they aren't following them? My favorite example is that "women need to wear a veil everytime they pray because they aren't as good as men." Did you know the bible said that? Did you all? Do all you gals out there pray with a veil over your head? Well, you'd better start because the bible says so.

I love what Captain ABlairica had to say. Many of you have made really valid points. Just please don't forget, other Christian religions are bassakwards too. But Catholics are certainly the most vocal, so I guess I should expect they would be isolated.

Thank you for your comments! Btw, actually, many would say the first church sect would probably be the Coptics. I think the Catholic ("universal") Church came about in the 300's AD.

I just say, everyone be careful of what you THINK the Bible says, because you just might find yourself on the wrong side...It's strange how people can ignore everything else about the Bible, what it says in the Old Testament prohibiting violating certain dietary laws, but we're so stringent about opposing homosexuality. It's easy to think that, because we find it gross and nasty ourselves, we find Scripture verses to justify our contempt and disgust. Btw, verses in the Old Testament prohibiting gay sex were not because God was personally grossed out by it, but because there was a very strong emphasis on procreative sex. "Get some kids out of it, ferGawshsakes!!!"

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica

Thank you for your comments! Btw, actually, many would say the first church sect would probably be the Coptics. I think the Catholic ("universal") Church came about in the 300's AD.

You are so right. I was hardly familiar with the Coptics until you mentioned them, and then I looked them up. Thanks. It's so great how I went to Catholic School for one year, and they teach us the wrong thing--saying we were the first formed Christian Religion. Oh well. And I'm sure many people don't think it's possible for me to be Christian if I don't follow the bible. Well, I know what I believe, and I'm comfortable with it. I hope you all are comfortable with what you believe as well.

:wave:

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Cashodeen


You are so right. I was hardly familiar with the Coptics until you mentioned them, and then I looked them up. Thanks. It's so great how I went to Catholic School for one year, and they teach us the wrong thing--saying we were the first formed Christian Religion. Oh well. And I'm sure many people don't think it's possible for me to be Christian if I don't follow the bible. Well, I know what I believe, and I'm comfortable with it. I hope you all are comfortable with what you believe as well.

:wave:

Yeah, it's understandable that the Catholic Church would think of itself as the "first" church, with St. Peter being the first Pope and all that... (Didn't Popes come around actually much later?) I think every church likes to think of itself as being as close to the original as possible...but it was the Coptic church actually. And don't let people intimidate you if they don't think you follow the Bible. No one really follows it to a T, and I don't think we're really meant to. It's what's inside you that counts. God has a bigger problem with people's arrogance than with people who are still trying to work things out.

This might be a drag to talk about religion, blah blah blah, on a thread about gays, but a lot of people here are having to deal with religious intolerance or trying to reconcile their sexuality with their religious beliefs.

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica

Yeah, it's understandable that the Catholic Church would think of itself as the "first" church, with St. Peter being the first Pope and all that... (Didn't Popes come around actually much later?) I think every church likes to think of itself as being as close to the original as possible...but it was the Coptic church actually. And don't let people intimidate you if they don't think you follow the Bible. No one really follows it to a T, and I don't think we're really meant to. It's what's inside you that counts. God has a bigger problem with people's arrogance than with people who are still trying to work things out.

This might be a drag to talk about religion, blah blah blah, on a thread about gays, but a lot of people here are having to deal with religious intolerance or trying to reconcile their sexuality with their religious beliefs.

I looked some things up because I really didn't have a clue before. The Copts existed all the way back to ancient Egypt, but didn't convert to Christianity until the A.D. 100s and 200s. That's still before the Catholic Church, which, like you said, came about in the 300s. According to my encyclopedia, it wasn't an official religion until they were given freedom by Rome, in the 300s.

The first Pope, St. Peter, is said to be the first Pope until he died in the year 67 AD. I can find nothing that says the Catholic Church was official in 67 or before, so in my book, The Copts still stand. I suppose since St. Peter and the following Popes eventually lead to the Catholic Church, that's why my school was so compfortable with calling it the first Christian Religion. Come to think of it, I learned the same thing in public school because our history books talked about the rise of Christianity. I'm suprised the school allowed such discussion. They usually have a fit when any relgion talk erupts.
Well, so none of you will have a fit over religion talk on this thread, I'll cut it here. :) Sorry everybody. :wave:

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by gbscott1954


Well, in my opinion Homosexuality is immoral and it goes against
the word of our heavenly father. And you should believe in
heaven and hell-and I will tell you why:because one of these
days you will be in hell if you don't repent of your sinful ways.

But, I am not suprised that you are of this opinion-after all, look
at what the U.S. has become:drugs, alcohol, crime and violence
plus all brands of immorality are rampant in the streets of our
cities. It seems like we no longer have a moral standard to guide
us as americans. It is time we got back to the bible and time we
eliminated the democratic party and allowed only the republican
party to exist. Plus, we need to respect our military personnel
and law enforcement officers much more than we do as a nation
today. I wonder if we really mean it when we sing "God Bless
America" or if we are just singing lines. I think we need to put
the bible back in our schools and churches should be free to do
whatever they want to spread the name of the lord almighty.

I bet you are probably a lesbian yourself and drink alcohol as well.

Just kinda makes ya feel good all over, duzn't it, people!!:D :love: :cheers: :clap: :rock: Praise the Lord and pass the Fahstah's!!:happyface Ahstrailian feh Beeah!!!:liplick:

[Czas na Zywiec]

Originally posted by gbscott1954

I bet you are probably a lesbian yourself and drink alcohol as well.

:lol: Looks like someone is forgetting their bible and the passage 'Judge not lest ye be judged'. You don't even KNOW her and are calling her a lesbian and an alcoholic right off the bat. Looks like you need to follow your bible more closely. :nonono:

Just because she believes that homosexuals should receive the same respect as any other human being doesn't mean she's gay. I'm about as girl-crazy as one guy can get, yet I don't look down on other people because of their sexual preference. I always believed those matters should stay out of the public eye and only be a concern to the person themself.

[Hollow]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)


2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

no cuz god dont want ppl to be gay

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

its a lifelong thing but they cant help it so i dunno

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

i dunno maybe

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings

where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?
they cant help it if theyre naturally attracted to some1 but i guess they can go for the opposite gender if they wanted to

[vienna waits]

Originally posted by gbscott1954


Well, in my opinion Homosexuality is immoral and it goes against
the word of our heavenly father. And you should believe in
heaven and hell-and I will tell you why:because one of these
days you will be in hell if you don't repent of your sinful ways.

But, I am not suprised that you are of this opinion-after all, look
at what the U.S. has become:drugs, alcohol, crime and violence
plus all brands of immorality are rampant in the streets of our
cities. It seems like we no longer have a moral standard to guide
us as americans. It is time we got back to the bible and time we
eliminated the democratic party and allowed only the republican
party to exist. Plus, we need to respect our military personnel
and law enforcement officers much more than we do as a nation
today. I wonder if we really mean it when we sing "God Bless
America" or if we are just singing lines. I think we need to put
the bible back in our schools and churches should be free to do
whatever they want to spread the name of the lord almighty.

I bet you are probably a lesbian yourself and drink alcohol as well.

I really hate it when adults take their frustrations towards America as a whole out on the good and innocent teenagers. Stop trying to force your opinion on others. And what does alcohol have to do with anything?

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by gbscott1954
Alcohol is today's moral venom as far as I am concerned. And who
says teenagers are innocent all the time? Look at what some of
them do in their spare time! Britney Spears comes to ones mind.

Amazing. Trully amazing. Original Prankster points out, 'Judge not lest ye be judged', and you dodge that statment and only choose to talk about alcohol (which I must say, I was curious about your take on that.) Now I must ask you point blank: How do you feel about going against the bible with your judgements?

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by gbscott1954


Alcohol is today's moral venom as far as I am concerned. And who
says teenagers are innocent all the time? Look at what some of
them do in their spare time! Britney Spears comes to ones mind.

Uhhh, do you remember reading about an period in American history called Prohibition? Where they added an Amendment to the Constitution banning the production, sale, and consumption of alcohol? Big-time crime arose from the sale of bootleg booze, and you had guys like Al Capone running things in Chicago. Prohibition ran from the mid-1920's to 1933 when they repealed the amendment. Prohibition didn't stop people from drinking. They went to speakeasies to imbibe underground.

And what about Christ making water into wine? Forget that verse? How about all the centuries of making wine and beer by CHRISTIANS?? What was that German beer law in 1215 or sometime that said making a bad beer was a crime against Christian love? Probably haven't tried Chimay ale, a Belgian brew made by Trappist monks? Good stuff. Yeah, alcohol, just like anything--INCLUDING fundamentalist Christianity, can be abused and turned into a bad thing. It's not "moral poison" unless one allows it to be--just like religion. It's like food, it can be good, it can nourish your body, and be part of a way of socializing with people, dinners and potlucks, but too much of it can be bad--you can become overweight and run the risk of heart attacks and other health problems. Too little of it, and you can starve and not be able to fight off diseases. Water is good, it can clean out your system and keep your body running, as well as clean or cool you,
but it can also be bad--too much and you have a flood, too little and you have drought. Fire is good, it can cook food and warm you, too much and it burns everything out of control, too little and we all freeze. Not to belabor the point, but sex is good, it is used to express love and intimacy and pleasure between two people, which we all need, as well as making babies, too much of it and we become promiscuous and risk catching and passing STD's and AIDS, or we create unwanted pregnancies. Too little of it and we run out of people--plus we become violent (a proven fact).

The one thing I would say about the goodness of alcohol is (in moderation) it is healthy to drink red wine to help prevent blood clots. The bad thing about alcohol is pretty much obvious...

And another thing about Britney Spears: she's in her 20's. She can make her own decisions.

[vienna waits]

Originally posted by gbscott1954


Alcohol is today's moral venom as far as I am concerned. And who
says teenagers are innocent all the time? Look at what some of
them do in their spare time! Britney Spears comes to ones mind.

Still, you shouldnt group all teenagers as one whole. I know that there are tons of teens drinking alcohol, having sex, taking drugs, etc. But that doesn't mean that everyone is, and there is no reason to hold that against those who dont do those things.

[Sterling Holobyte]

Originally posted by LucyFan

1) Do you think homosexuality is
a) plain immoral (wrong)?
b) spiritually immoral?
I don't know if immoral is the word I would use, although some of the things that homosexuals do are immoral, just as some things that heterosexuals do are immoral.
I think the word I would use would be unnatural. Forget religion for a moment; Homosexuals are going against the will of nature. Male animals are not supposed to mate with other males. Same for females. Nature gave us the genitals we have for a reason! The reasons for the homosexual's rejection of the natural way of things is a direct result of the evolution of our brains and our instinctual tendency to learn, experience and explore new things and new ways of doing things. Simply put, you could say that homosexuality came out of boredom for the natural, defined way of human life.
Personally, I look forward to the day when we evolve enough(in our minds and bodies) to rise beyond any sexual instinct. It will happen. But that's just my (long) opinion.


2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?
No. They have as much a right to look down on homosexuality because of their beliefs as homosexual's who look down on the Catholic Church do.


3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?
No. In religion(Christian, at least) we are all sinners.

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?
No. This, along with the notion that you are "born gay" are myth's perpetrated by the homosexual community to manipulate the public and themselves into believing that what the things they do are natural and right, in an attempt to blend in more with the mainstream and thus make themselves less of a target of violence by bigots, and by their own hands.

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?
Yes. Same as answers to 1 and 4 above.

Keep in mind, these are only my opinions!

[Cashodeen]

Origanally posted by gbscott1954
Yes, but she was 17 when she started out as a big-time star.

Her age when she became famous has nothing to do with what you previously said or with what Captain ABlairica said. Are you trying to say she drank back then? How do you know this?

AND, I am still waiting for your answer to my last question.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?



I think homosexuals should not show their feelings for each other in public. Something I don't want to see at all. Keep it in doors

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by SOLOMON




I think homosexuals should not show their feelings for each other in public. Something I don't want to see at all. Keep it in doors

Gee, not too much in common with your Biblical counterpart, there. Where's the wisdom??:rolleyes:

[~*Hannah_Lee*~]

Originally posted by SOLOMON




I think homosexuals should not show their feelings for each other in public. Something I don't want to see at all. Keep it in doors

Personally, I don't much care for seeing any PDA's. I can't stand that. How about everyone, gay or straight, keep it indoors??

[bandito]

Originally posted by ~*Hannah_Lee*~


Personally, I don't much care for seeing any PDA's. I can't stand that. How about everyone, gay or straight, keep it indoors?? DITTO :)

[TibbyTibby2]

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)? no

b) spiritually immoral? no

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not? yes... everyone has a choice in life.. they can make the choices they want

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not? no..everyone has a chance.. and sexuality does not change that chance

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not? no.. u choose who u are

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not? yes.. ur attracted to who ur attracted to

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by LucyFan
Hi all :wave:,
I just want to see the views and opinions on this matter. Here it goes:

1) Do you think homosexuality is

a) plain immoral (wrong)?

b) spiritually immoral?

2) Do you think its wrong that the Catholic Church looks down on homosexuality? Why or why not?

3) Do you think that homosexuals are condemed into hell and therefore have no chance to get to Heaven? Why or why not?

4) Do you believe that there is such a thing as a "gay" gene? Why or why not?

5) Do you think people have control over their sexual feelings where it comes to liking a particular gender? Why or why not?

Actually I have been avoiding these posts because I have different takes on the subject, but I saw on another post your struggle with the issue.

So for the hard-hitting answers.
1. a. It is unnatural in the sense where you cannot pro-create. Homosexuality is a lust-driven urge.

b. Is it spiritually wong: Definately Yes. In the Old Testament days, laws were the most strict because it was before Jesus came to die for sins. In fact, when you have sex with someone you are creating a covenant with that person. If you have sex with one or more persons without marriage, you are classified as a whoremonger and whoremongers do not enter Heaven (Ephesians 5:5). Now Hebrews 13:4 states this: Marriage is honorable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.
How does God Judge these people? Well AIDS is one way as well as other diseases that HAVE NO CURE.
Also Marriage is a sacred covenant that is supposed to grant the second covenant (Sex) and reproducing people. Our society have got it all wrong, so it’s hard to work with and bring back the original intent going back to the first years of human civilization.

Moving on,
Leviticus 20:13 says: If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have commited an abomination (An act that offends God). they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. (Now what the latter part of that verse meant was that in the ancient days in Israel, if someone defiled their bodies, they would have had to be put to death. In fact if you read on, Moses then goes on to talk about what we know today as incest, bestiality, affairs and so on.

Remember that by Jesus dying on the cross and us accepting him as our Savior, we are free from the law and his blood “bleaches” out our past and future sins before we go to God the Father (who does not allow sin into heaven). Thusly, we are forever forgiven.

Now can a Christian engage in a homosexual act or urge? Yes. They may feel guilty afterwards and need to ask forgiveness (which will cleanse them), but I believe that a person can get into the urge especially in a time where homosexuality is more mainstream and more normalized in this culture. Jesus even predicted that in the end times, some of his sheep will have gone astray and go in their own way.

Now, as a Christian I have to say this: Despite what the Bible says on the matter, I have the battle of the Spirit Versus the Flesh in this matter. When you accept Christ, you accept the Spirit. Your flesh is your carnal urges and what not and contains sin. Your flesh is holy and trying to change your attitudes and thinking to live more like the Lord.

The main reason that I have avoided message board posts like this is because carnally, I am blind to see what is wrong with homosexuality. In other words, it is just different. Spiritually, I see everything wrogn with it and why it is immoral. Sometimes I turn my back on either the flesh or the spirit, only to later discover that I am divided on the issue.

What I posted Biblically is THE TRUTH. Now if I want to put the TRUTH to rest a bit, then I certainly have that right. In other words, if a homosexual person came up to me, I would not condemn them and hate them for being one. Hating is not what Jesus taught us. My sister has a friend who is bisexual and I told her basically what I told you. I said that spiritually it is immoral, but carnally it seems to be acceptable. There I go again. A split decision. The Truth will never change, but my carnal take on it can. On this topic, I have a bad case of “Doublemindedness” (instability on this decision). I can say one thing and become a hypocrite, or I can say the other and be a hypocrite. I want you to make the decision.

2. I know that at one point, the Catholic Church really condemned homosexuality, but that is a works thing. The sanctions on homosexuality, I think have been lifted some. I also thought that they didn’t care too much about the subject because of the issues with little boys and stuff. What I mean is that, they would transfer a Priest to another congregation if there was any suspicion of foul play. If the Catholic Church was really strict on the matter, then that person’s job as a Priest would be terminated.-- I believe.

3. Homosexuals are condemned to hell unless they accept Christ as their savior. Jesus will forgive ANY sin and by sin, I mean anything that is against the original law. Jesus will forgive your sin and with his help, he can help you overcome it. If you decide to continue in the lifestyle, you are subject to Judgement. Whether it is an STD, whether your partner dies and you are upset about where they may go spiritually…. There are tons of things that can happen. One thing is for sure and that is if you accept Christ, you will not be subject to the Hell (The place where EVERYONE (including me) is supposed to die in their sins), but by God’s grace, he sent his only son to take on that punishment for us without us having to actually go through it ourselves. Isn’t that cool!?!?!?!

4. A “Gay Gene”? I had a theory on if there was a gay gene. Of course it is a THEORY and cannot be proven, but here it goes. I thought that Scientifically, I thought that possibly to many of the opposite chromosomes could have entered the wrong sex.

Here is what I mean:
Men have X Chromosomes and women have Y Chromosomes. I thought that maybe at one time too many Y Chromosomes could have entered the male (In this case) body structure, possibly triggering those men to think like females do. That theory I made up for the people who look like the opposite gender and who are attracted to the same gender because they couldn’t get a partner from the opposite gender.

I stick now to the point that it is an urge, and it is a choice to many. I also think that it also has to do with someone who is raised. For example, A friend and I went out with this one guy and his mother was divorced. He grew up feminine-like and I thought he was gay. Now, I am sure that he has been called names at school and such, and with being called a “***” so many times, he may actually become one thinking that he is born to be one.

Many of people thought that I was gay because I like to talk to people, be witty, and joke around. I am not the “typical guy” who just gropes, grunts, and crushes a beer can on my head (LOL).
The point I’m trying to make is that I’m pretty social and some men find that threatening. There is this one guy at work who just thought I was gay off the top of his head and every time I would say “Hi” to him, he would not respond. Maybe he was questioning his own masculinity there, but I was getting pissed. I would then write about the situation in my comedy satire scripts and release them to the public to read. I don’t know if he read any, but I get a “hello” every time I say hello to him.

5. I think that most people have control of their sexual feelings towards a specific gender because they do not want to get hurt. For example, if Joanne had an urge towards Brianna, and Brianna was straight, I think that if Joanne went to her and said that she liked her, Brianna would get a little scared and try to watch her moves so that she does not feel that she is leading Brianna on. I think that some are careful and some are not. I think it is dangerous to not be careful.

LucyFan, even I have had struggles with this subject and I know the war on it. If you have had bad experiences or if you just do not seem to attract members of the oppisite sex at times, then I can see how these thoughts can affect you.

[Czas na Zywiec]

Originally posted by RWCTV

Men have X Chromosomes and women have Y Chromosomes.

No, men have XY chromosomes while women have XX.

[ABlairican Pie]

AIDS is NOT God's judgement on anyone.

[~*Hannah_Lee*~]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica
AIDS is NOT God's judgement on anyone.

NO! I don't think God wishes bad things on anyone.

[Cashodeen]

I can't believe I'm here again. I might as well unsubscribe to this thread because I'm getting off track. Whatever...
Originally posted by RWCTV

Jesus will forgive ANY sin and by sin, I mean anything that is against the original law.

Actually, no. One sin is not forgiven--blasphemy of the holy spirit. It's in the bible... the book you quoted all over the place in your thread. Just thought you would like to know you had a bit of an inaccuracy there.

4. A “Gay Gene”? I had a theory on if there was a gay gene. Of course it is a THEORY and cannot be proven, but here it goes. I thought that Scientifically, I thought that possibly to many of the opposite chromosomes could have entered the wrong sex.

Here is what I mean:
Men have X Chromosomes and women have Y Chromosomes. I thought that maybe at one time too many Y Chromosomes could have entered the male (In this case) body structure, possibly triggering those men to think like females do. That theory I made up for the people who look like the opposite gender and who are attracted to the same gender because they couldn’t get a partner from the opposite gender.

What an ingenius theory. It's called Klinefelter Syndrome. And it's not the reason for homosexuality necessarily. Most gay men have normal chromosomes, and those with Klinefelter Syndrome may be any orientation.

How does God Judge these people? Well AIDS is one way as well as other diseases that HAVE NO CURE.

Oh, I guess God has punished those who have gotten AIDS other ways too, such as those hemaphilics who were given HIV infected blood trasnfusions, and children of Africa. But, wait... punished for what? Oh hmm, "innocent people" have AIDS as well.


I'm through.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
I can't believe I'm here again. I might as well unsubscribe to this thread because I'm getting off track. Whatever...


Oh, I guess God has punished those who have gotten AIDS other ways too, such as those hemaphilics who were given HIV infected blood trasnfusions, and children of Africa. But, wait... punished for what? Oh hmm, "innocent people" have AIDS as well.


I'm through.

DON'T UNSUBSCRIBE!!! You have some great points. Lessee, so our good buddy Robert says God punishes people with diseases that have no cure. Hmmm.... So like when Jerry Lewis has those telethons for finding a cure for muscular dystrophy, he's going against God's will--because those "victims" must have done something to get it--for what, we don't know. There are plenty of diseases out there which don't have a cure, is that "God's punishment"?? And when doctors and scientists DO find cures, they're really, in fact, messing with God's plan?? Evil pagans and Gawd-mockers.:mad: :rolleyes: God's such a loving God and all, but he's really hot into punishing his SINFUL creation...

How medieval.

[LucyFan]

Originally posted by RWCTV
LucyFan, even I have had struggles with this subject and I know the war on it. If you have had bad experiences or if you just do not seem to attract members of the oppisite sex at times, then I can see how these thoughts can affect you.

I have been struggling with this subject for the passed few years. And to be quite honest, I really don't know what to believe anymore. It's like I am divided in two halfs over this issue. I am constantly fighting with each side of this issue to figure out which is the more correct and truthful way to go. The problem is that each side has a clear, cut case with both strong and weak points. They often contradict each other to the piont where you just want to scream and say "with the hell of it, I'll be much better off creating my 'own' way". Right now, I am so lost and confused and I really have no clue what to do. I guess you can say that I am stuck in the middle of all this. :sigh: I wish this wasn't so complicated.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica


Lessee, so our good buddy Robert says God punishes people with diseases that have no cure. Hmmm.... So like when Jerry Lewis has those telethons for finding a cure for muscular dystrophy, he's going against God's will--because those "victims" must have done something to get it--for what, we don't know. There are plenty of diseases out there which don't have a cure, is that "God's punishment"?? And when doctors and scientists DO find cures, they're really, in fact, messing with God's plan?? Evil pagans and Gawd-mockers.:mad: :rolleyes: God's such a loving God and all, but he's really hot into punishing his SINFUL creation...

How medieval.

Wait a Minute!!!
Some of you are making it sound like I am saying that all forms of AIDS is judgement. Now I know why people from the past have been scolded and it is all a misunderstanding that was not intended.

AIDS is most commonly spread through sexual contact. I hear more about hetero and homosexual acts being the cause of spreading AIDS and by Judgement, I really mean that through sexual acts that are commonly spread by people who are not married and tend to sleep around, God just allows what is to happen to them happen to them. I didn't even dream that I would be accused of classifying EVERYONE WHO HAS AIDS AS BEING JUDGED!!!!

Yes, AIDS is spread through blood transfusions and can be spread accidentally, but I was talking about sexual acts and keeping the issue in that fence. I did not mean for someone to misinterperet the entire thing by creating an argument that has nothing to do with the topic and this topic is sexuality.

Making me sound like I am classifying EVERYONE who has AIDS as being judged is simply a misunderstanding and was not originally intended to sound that way.

I think that Scientists should find cures for AIDS even if people contract it sexually. I think that one of the reasons that a cure hasn't been found is because if there was a cure, then people will sleep around with everyone like crazy.

In a prophetic light, they may in fact find a cure for AIDS. If they found a cure for AIDS, then I think that people would sleep around more and not seem to care, and God would attract people's attention through different means during the Tribulation period. Now, this is all speculation on my part, by whose to say that it could not happen?

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
One sin is not forgiven--blasphemy of the holy spirit. It's in the bible... the book you quoted all over the place in your thread.

You are thinking about the Unpardonable Sin described in Luke 12:10

And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him; but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

What this verse means is that if the Holy Spirit is drawing you to Salvation through Jesus Christ, and you reject it, then you have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and when you die, you are not forgiven and you spend eternity where sin dwells. Of course, that is if you die rejecting Salvation. Some people may put it off to another date or if something of some significance happens to them.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
Oh, I guess God has punished those who have gotten AIDS other ways too, such as those hemaphilics who were given HIV infected blood trasnfusions, and children of Africa. But, wait... punished for what? Oh hmm, "innocent people" have AIDS as well.


I cleared this misunderstanding up on another post. I was talking about people who contract AIDS in the sexual realm. It is very seldom that you hear about a married couple contracting AIDS although it is possible. There are many strands of ways that this can be interpreted, but I was talking about only in sexuality whether it's hetro or homo.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by LucyFan


I have been struggling with this subject for the passed few years. And to be quite honest, I really don't know what to believe anymore. It's like I am divided in two halfs over this issue. I am constantly fighting with each side of this issue to figure out which is the more correct and truthful way to go. The problem is that each side has a clear, cut case with both strong and weak points. They often contradict each other to the piont where you just want to scream and say "with the hell of it, I'll be much better off creating my 'own' way". Right now, I am so lost and confused and I really have no clue what to do. I guess you can say that I am stuck in the middle of all this. :sigh: I wish this wasn't so complicated.

I know what you mean. You go to the movies and there are some gay innuendos that look kind of tempting. People like Jerry Falwell after 9/11 said that the terror attacks were because of homosexuals, abortionists and whatever, and President Bush, Rush Limbaugh and others were upset with Falwell with what he said, including me.

What I mean is that I think that the subject has been so mainstreamed and accepted by society.

Kind of like that episode of "The Simpsons" where there was a gay parade and two gay guys said: "We're here, we're queer, get used to it!"

Lisa: We are used to it.

Guy #1: (huffs) Spoiled Sport.

Although that hilarious clip is from a hilarious sitcom, there is some truth to it.

I never had good luck with girls and questioned the issue myself. The struggle continues because I know that the Bible condemns it, yet there are certain situations that happen that make the battle harder and harder to fight.

For example: I have been on 3 dates in my life. Each time, I have gotten the "I like you as a brother or a good friend" speech. Now what am I supposed to think? I am socialable and have a good time. When I talk to women, I talk to them as one person to another. That is the only way I know. I joke around all the time. Some guys have labeled me as "gay" because I don't always just gawk and think of ways of laying them. I think about personality, because I think about the future. Some people think that is pretty "gay" and it looks as though the whole world wants me to walk that way, but if I was open on that decision as a final one, I know that trouble will abound in my direction, especially with my luck.

[Kitt]

Originally posted by RWCTV


Wait a Minute!!!
Some of you are making it sound like I am saying that all forms of AIDS is judgement. I didn't even dream that I would be accused of classifying EVERYONE WHO HAS AIDS AS BEING JUDGED!!!!


Making me sound like I am classifying EVERYONE who has AIDS as being judged is simply a misunderstanding and was not originally intended to sound that way.

I think that Scientists should find cures for AIDS even if people contract it sexually. I think that one of the reasons that a cure hasn't been found is because if there was a cure, then people will sleep around with everyone like crazy.

In a prophetic light, they may in fact find a cure for AIDS. If they found a cure for AIDS, then I think that people would sleep around more and not seem to care, and God would attract people's attention through different means during the Tribulation period. Now, this is all speculation on my part, by whose to say that it could not happen? You're right Robert. If someone could think the way that you do -- God judges and kills people slowly and painfully for having sex outside of marriage -- then gosh oh mosh, anything could happen. Who's to say? So if scientists foil God's plan by finding a cure for AIDS, do you have any ideas for God? He/she is going to need a new sinister torture to replace his/her unfortunate loss of the punishing AIDS virus? What can you come up with for God? Can you help?

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Kitt
God judges and kills people slowly and painfully for having sex outside of marriage -- then gosh oh mosh, anything could happen.

Judgement doesn't always necessarily mean that he kills people. There is different means of Judgement. In this case, he steps back and allows bad things to happen.

Now, there is of course the case of Elton John. Elton John has a partner and he has not come out with news that he has a disease.

Homo and Heterosexual people enter a dangerous situation if they go and have relations with multiple partners.
In these days, most people who have AIDS don't even know they have AIDS or will not tell their partners that they have the disease in fear that they will be lonely for the rest of their lives. A great number of people in this case are teenagers.

Now, would I ever have sex before marriage? I have not had to make that decision, but everyone (including Christians) make decisions that are opposite of what we know is right. Christians fall into temptation and sin. We are sinners, but we are forgiven through the blood of Christ, including Christians that have engaged in homosexual activity, and that, in fact, has happened before as well.

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by RWCTV
You are thinking about the Unpardonable Sin described in Luke 12:10

And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him; but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

What this verse means is that if the Holy Spirit is drawing you to Salvation through Jesus Christ, and you reject it, then you have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and when you die, you are not forgiven and you spend eternity where sin dwells. Of course, that is if you die rejecting Salvation. Some people may put it off to another date or if something of some significance happens to them.

Actually, that's not the verse I was referring to. So you wasted your time trying to tell ME what that verse meant.

[Cashodeen]

RWCTV, Here's what you put:
How does God Judge these people? Well AIDS is one way as well as other diseases that HAVE NO CURE. Perhaps you should have been a little more careful how you worded it in the beginning since you do feel these diseases can occur innocently. Since your last posts, I understand what you're saying, and I still disagree. If God actually put AIDS and other incurable diseases on earth to "judge" these siners, then wouldn't he isolate the diseases' causes so the "innocent" wouldn't contract them as well? AND, people can protect themselves from AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases. (Gasp), I guess they are fouling up God's plan to kill them!

Well, that's how I see it. But you go on believing what you always have. And Kitt, I never want to think the way he does. Just like you two don't want to think like I do. That's why I wanted to unsubscribe to this thread (and thanks for the post, Captain ABlairica!) because I'm not going to change anyone's minds, and they aren't going to change mine. These are all very touchy subjects and I really don't get any enjoyment out of debating them, like other topics.

[Czas na Zywiec]

Originally posted by RWCTV

A great number of people in this case are teenagers.

Yea, that's true. We have no morals and never have anything to do, so we just sleep with anybody who's willing to give us 10 minutes of their time to do our thing.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
RWCTV, Here's what you put:
Perhaps you should have been a little more careful how you worded it in the beginning since you do feel these diseases can occur innocently. Since your last posts, I understand what you're saying, and I still disagree. If God actually put AIDS and other incurable diseases on earth to "judge" these siners, then wouldn't he isolate the diseases' causes so the "innocent" wouldn't contract them as well? AND, people can protect themselves from AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases. (Gasp), I guess they are fouling up God's plan to kill them!

Well, that's how I see it. But you go on believing what you always have. And Kitt, I never want to think the way he does. Just like you two don't want to think like I do. That's why I wanted to unsubscribe to this thread (and thanks for the post, Captain ABlairica!) because I'm not going to change anyone's minds, and they aren't going to change mine. These are all very touchy subjects and I really don't get any enjoyment out of debating them, like other topics.

There was something I wanted to say in response to someone offering a "Christian" justification for bigotry toward gays. I wanted to make an observation that I think God showed me over 15 years ago when I was re-examining my faith, that IT'S MUCH EASIER TO HATE AND FEAR THAN IT IS TO LOVE. Love is awfully hard work. It's easy to attack and react to people who are different--and being able to justify it in God's name. That is one of the reasons why I rejected the fundamentalist way of looking at things, slowly I began to open myself up to thinking that God wanted me to look at gays, etc., a little differently. So no matter what RC says, it's all about judgement. God would have people live in total tension with themselves than to come around and think that maybe, just maybe, accepting oneself as gay may be...okay?? Why fight against the current?
Does it ever occur to "Christians" that we may have all the right answers and everything, and are able to provide a rock-solid defense of everything we believe--and STIIIILLLL have it all wrong? Why do we latch onto proof-text Bible verses that stroke our sense of outrage, hostility, and indignation? It seems strange that both our wrath and indifference toward "different" people lie side by side. I guess with the issue of gays, we have an amazing inability to empathize. Why does fundamentalism keep us from being able to love?

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Original Prankster


Yea, that's true. We have no morals and never have anything to do, so we just sleep with anybody who's willing to give us 10 minutes of their time to do our thing.

I'm not talking about ALL teens. If I meant ALL I would have said ALL. I said Most and that was according to a study. Here is a part of an article that backs me up on the subject. You decide for yourself.

Among young people, HIV is most commonly spread through sexual transmission. By 12th grade, 65% of American youth are sexually active. And of the 12 million Americans with STDs, about two-thirds are people under the age of 25, suggesting that many adolescents and young adults in this country are not practicing safer sex.
http://www.thebody.com/amfar/keeping_count.html

65% is a majority of teens, and that was from a 2001 report. You won't believe some of the predictions that some are saying for the next 20 years. It's pretty freaky.

I never said ALL. When you take something out of context, you get a pretext and just about, if not everyone who has replied to my posts on this subject has done exactly that.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen


Actually, that's not the verse I was referring to. So you wasted your time trying to tell ME what that verse meant.

Then what the hell did you mean?! Why did you mention it to begin with? Enlighten me please.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
RWCTV, Here's what you put:
If God actually put AIDS and other incurable diseases on earth to "judge" these siners, then wouldn't he isolate the diseases' causes so the "innocent" wouldn't contract them as well? AND, people can protect themselves from AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases. (Gasp), I guess they are fouling up God's plan to kill them!


Please Cashodeen, like I said before, when you take something out of context, you get a pretext. God would not isolate those diseases from the innocent. Some who may innocently contract AIDS may possibly do some good out of the horrible disease. And before I get slammed for someone misunderstanding this statement, let me say this.

Ryan White was a prime example. He got AIDS through a blood transfusion and ended up raising money for AIDS research and became a beacon of hope for people who had contracted the virus. I do not want AIDS to exist, no matter what. It is just there.

As for Judgement, God will provide a way out of certain situations. For example, when I was a teen, at my cousin's house, a girl took a liking to me. She just met me and she wanted to sleep with me. All I thought about was if she is this easy with me, a guy whom she just met, then how easy has she been with other guys from the past? Eventually something came up and the situation was dismissed without any hurt feelings.

Another time was when this strange psychotic guy wanted to jump one of my managers after work because he kicked the strange man out because he was talking to one of the girls about having sex with animals and scaring the hell out of her. The strange man, who came into my work half drunk told me what he was going to do to Todd when he left the building. He planned on jumping him after he got off of work. I then told Todd. Todd got one of the bigger guys outside and told the man, when Cop cars were coming around, that the COPS were on their way. If God wasn't looking out for that man, then why would the man tell me what he was planning to do? He could have just went out there, not told me, and Todd would have had to deal with the man without knowing that the man was there to begin with.

With uncurable disease, when someone knows that disease is there, and that it may be contracted by an act that can be avoided, then if that person follows through knowing that there are vital risks, then that person has bypassed the warnings and now they live by taking chance. One thing about chance is that it can be against you, and by judgement, I mean, in the sexual sense, God allows the chances to take effect rather than creating a way out after you made the mistake to begin with.

I mean, how many pregnancy fears are out there today? That is an example of chance.

Judgement is flexible, and if someone is misunderstanding or skimming through what I really mean on the subject matter, then maybe the word "judgement" is too strong for people to handle and should probably be avoided. Abusing this word and it's meaning is dangerous, because it has different meanings.

[Cashodeen]

The passage I was talking about is Mark 3:28.

[Cashodeen]

RWCTV, don't feel I'm jumping on you, but I never took a thing you said out of context. When you bluntly say that AIDS is God's judgement on the "sinners" then how can a disagreer not bring up the "innocent" contracting the disease? I understand you feel the cause for AIDS is different in some than it is in others. It's funny how you fundamentalists can JUDGE that God has AIDS as a punishment for the "sinners" but then you all are left clueless as to why it exists for the innocent. You also said that "God would not isolate those diseases from the innocent." Why not? If God can isolate a reason for AIDS (on the sinners), then why didn't he just isolate the disease altogether? I understand if you don't have an answer. Afterall, we can't know everything God does, but then maybe some shouldn't be so quick to have a definite reason for some things when they can't figure out a reason for others. But whatever, that's your judgment. Or was AIDS mentioned in the bible?

And yes, I realize you think it's a terrible disease that needs a cure. That's great.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
The passage I was talking about is Mark 3:28.

Okay, I believe that the explanation I gave for the Luke 12:10, also applies to this one as well.

Mark 3:28 and 29 says this:
Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewithsoever they shall blaspheme: But he that shall blaspheme the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:

This verse says that that person is in danger of eternal damnation. The explanation I gave about the other similar verse from Luke goes for this verse as well.

If the Holy Spirit calls someone to Christ, and they do not receive Christ, then they have sinned against the Holy Spirit and when they die in their sins, it is too late. When someone rejects the Holy Spirit at one point, they are in danger of eternal damnation, but if one changes their mind, or they accept Christ (even at a later date), then they have accepted the drawing of the Holy Spirit and caught on to the Holy Spirit's drawing them to Christ. Then if someone accepts Christ, then they are forgiven and did not create that "blasphemy" to begin with. I think in order to fulfill that blasphemy, you have to die without accepting Christ, even after the Holy Spirit has been working through you.

[Cashodeen]

Wow, I should have known this would happen. Our bibles are different.

"I give you my word, every sin will be forgiven mankind and all the blasphemes men utter, but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven. He carries the guilt of his sin without end."

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
It's funny how you fundamentalists can JUDGE that God has AIDS as a punishment for the "sinners" but then you all are left clueless as to why it exists for the innocent.

I am not really a fundamentalist. I may have used some answers that seem to lean towards a fundamentalist intention.

I do not have all the answers. Some innocent people have done some good for the AIDS cause and I applaud them for it.

We do not have all the answers on everything. You do raise some good points on the subject matter. For people who contract diseases like this by total accident, I do not know why they get it to begin with. That is one of the mysteries of life.

I do not want anyone to get AIDS (especially homo or heterosexuals). Sexual desires are very tempting, and people follow those desires, but I do not wish AIDS on everyone or anyone who follow their desires as ALL PEOPLE fall into desires in one way or another.

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by LucyFan
The problem is that each side has a clear, cut case with both strong and weak points. They often contradict each other to the piont...

Since you're the one who began this thread, I'm particularly interested in your take on it. I won't pressure you to speak on all points, but what contradictions do you see for both sides?

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by RWCTV

I do not want anyone to get AIDS (especially homo or heterosexuals). Sexual desires are very tempting, and people follow those desires, but I do not wish AIDS on everyone or anyone who follow their desires as ALL PEOPLE fall into desires in one way or another.

You don't want people to contract AIDS, yet you think it is God's judgment. Do you think God is wrong for having this judgment? I know I'm trying to pull something out of you that you will never say, but if God has this disease for a reason, shouldn't you agree with it wholeheartedly?

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
Wow, I should have known this would happen. Our bibles are different.

"I give you my word, every sin will be forgiven mankind and all the blasphemes men utter, but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven. He carries the guilt of his sin without end."

Mine came out of the King James Version.
As for My New Century Version (the latest translation that translates with updates that have occurred in the English language)

I tell you the truth, all sins that people do and all things people say can be forgiven. But anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of a sin that continues forever.

Then verse 30 goes on to say:

Jesus said this because the teachers of the law said that he had an evil spirit inside him. (NCV)

Verse 30 in KJV:
Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen


You don't want people to contract AIDS, yet you think it is God's judgment. Do you think God is wrong for having this judgment? I know I'm trying to pull something out of you that you will never say, but if God has this disease for a reason, shouldn't you agree with it wholeheartedly?

I do not think that God is wrong for having this disease to begin with. It was originally a disease that came from monkeys, and it transferred to humans. I do not want people to go through the Tribulation period (Judgement at it's worse) and yet I warn people about that time period and how today's signs point to that time period as the years go on.

I have said that Judgement has different meanings. I think that it's God allowing the consequences to occur to people who make a choice. If someone has sex with someone, and the other person has AIDS, then God will not go out of his way to protect them. He will just allow them to get what will come to them without supernaturally removing the virus from that person. We all learn from our mistakes, and some who may contract the disease through certain sexual situations will learn from their mistakes, the hard way. I do not want those consequences to take effect, but they are there and people should acknowlege the fact before they get themselves into something that they may not be able to get out of.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by RWCTV


I do not think that God is wrong for having this disease to begin with. It was originally a disease that came from monkeys, and it transferred to humans. I do not want people to go through the Tribulation period (Judgement at it's worse) and yet I warn people about that time period and how today's signs point to that time period as the years go on.

I have said that Judgement has different meanings. I think that it's God allowing the consequences to occur to people who make a choice. If someone has sex with someone, and the other person has AIDS, then God will not go out of his way to protect them. He will just allow them to get what will come to them without supernaturally removing the virus from that person. We all learn from our mistakes, and some who may contract the disease through certain sexual situations will learn from their mistakes, the hard way. I do not want those consequences to take effect, but they are there and people should acknowlege the fact before they get themselves into something that they may not be able to get out of.

Gee, God "MADE AIDS"... though the punishment definitely not fitting the crime. :rolleyes:

[Cashodeen]

I'm going to have to cut out of this discussion. I'm trying to sort through it. LOL, you're making it tough. The fact that you even brought up AIDS in the beginning for the sinners shows that you think AIDS has a purpose for them. You called it a "judgement" but meant "Judgment" in a different meaning--that AIDS just happens to them. But I know you don't think it "just happens" to them the way it "just happens" to the innocent. Help me out on this, but you think AIDS is a way to show those "Sinners" what they are doing is wrong, right? That is what a consequence is, right? Yet, you don't wish this consequence on anyone, because afterall, you realize it is a dreadful disease and so forth. God obviously wishes this consequence on some, so they see the error of their ways, otherwise, he wouldn't have it be the purpose for the majority of AIDS cases--as you've pointed out.

Call me a judger here, but I think you're contradicting yourself. If you really feel God has made this as a consequence, isolated for the "sinners," you would agree with this consequence happening to them, because you should see God has planned it this way.

I think this will be my last post on the subject. It's gone so far, we're probably at a stand-still.

[ABlairican Pie]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
I'm going to have to cut out of this discussion. I'm trying to sort through it. LOL, you're making it tough. The fact that you even brought up AIDS in the beginning for the sinners shows that you think AIDS has a purpose for them. You called it a "judgement" but meant "Judgment" in a different meaning--that AIDS just happens to them. But I know you don't think it "just happens" to them the way it "just happens" to the innocent. Help me out on this, but you think AIDS is a way to show those "Sinners" what they are doing is wrong, right? That is what a consequence is, right? Yet, you don't wish this consequence on anyone, because afterall, you realize it is a dreadful disease and so forth. God obviously wishes this consequence on some, so they see the error of their ways, otherwise, he wouldn't have it be the purpose for the majority of AIDS cases--as you've pointed out.

Call me a judger here, but I think you're contradicting yourself. If you really feel God has made this as a consequence, isolated for the "sinners," you would agree with this consequence happening to them, because you should see God has planned it this way.

I think this will be my last post on the subject. It's gone so far, we're probably at a stand-still.

I'm assuming you're speaking to RC? Yeah, this topic gets crazy sometimes. I guess if it makes people feel better that God likes to inflict that kind of misery on some people while patting others on the head for being goody-two shoes, then what can you do.
We live in a weird day and age where we're more Christian than Jesus himself, but we're coming up short in the Love Department.
I guess when you look at it, the common cold is the disease you get for the sin of running around barefoot in wet weather. Like mother said.....:nonono:

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica

I'm assuming you're speaking to RC? Yeah, this topic gets crazy sometimes. I guess if it makes people feel better that God likes to inflict that kind of misery on some people while patting others on the head for being goody-two shoes, then what can you do.
We live in a weird day and age where we're more Christian than Jesus himself, but we're coming up short in the Love Department.
I guess when you look at it, the common cold is the disease you get for the sin of running around barefoot in wet weather. Like mother said.....:nonono:

LOLOL.

Yes, I was talking to RWCTV. It's been getting so heated, I've been forgetting to use quotes. Now I remember why I didn't want to get into this thread weeks ago. I just knew I was going to stick around and go back and forth with someone. It started off with saying "Don't blame JUST the Catholics," and here I am talking about AIDS being God's judgement on certain people. Why oh why, did I go on with something that will never get solved? And what's worst, your EXCELLENT post on the last page got lost in the debate.

I wish all Christians that seem so willing to judge judge judge and quote the bible, just look at your post and think about it thouroughly. Everyone should think of both sides thoroughly and judge for themselves what they feel is better. Of course, maybe they already have and choose to lean toward the fundamentalist ways. I've considered both sides, and could never be that way.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen
Help me out on this, but you think AIDS is a way to show those "Sinners" what they are doing is wrong, right? That is what a consequence is, right? Yet, you don't wish this consequence on anyone, because afterall, you realize it is a dreadful disease and so forth.

God obviously wishes this consequence on some, so they see the error of their ways, otherwise, he wouldn't have it be the purpose for the majority of AIDS cases--as you've pointed out.

Call me a judger here, but I think you're contradicting yourself. If you really feel God has made this as a consequence, isolated for the "sinners," you would agree with this consequence happening to them, because you should see God has planned it this way.


I will word my response in a different way:

AIDS is definately a risk, and having sex (without thinking of the consequences that might arise) will run your risks higher if you engage in it. When I mentioned marriage in the bible, think about this: How many married people get AIDS from each other? The reason that the bible says that you should to be married to have sex is because God does NOT want you to play around and possibly contract one of the earthbound consequences that come ouf of the risks that result in your actions. You may have sex with people and not contract something, but you are gambling with your life when you engage in what the bible refers to immoral sex, and God does not want people to hurt themselves. If I slept around my risks would be higher and higher, especially if I didn't know how may people my partner slept with. If my partner had sex with 20 people, and I just slept with that person, then it would be equivilent of me sleeping with 20 people as well and one or more of those people could have contracted an STD.

You said "God obviously wishes this consequence on some". God does not wish this consequence on anyone. He allows this to happen. Some people feel that it is a consequence because if you didn't engage in the act to begin with, and the disease came from that act, then you would have never contracted the disease if you hadn't participated in that act to begin with. That is why I worded it as a "Consequence".

I will even make it clearer by saying this: If you go to a grocery store and steal, then you are running the risk of getting caught, and if you do get caught, then you go to jail as the consequence.

Replying to me "contradicting myself", I do contradict myself in the sense that according to God, homosexuality is wrong. When I act on my flesh (in other words "put the rules aside") I don't have a problem with it. That is why at the very beginning I said that I have conflicting arguments on this issue. I proabably should have sent Lucy Fan a private message on this matter because I did not mean for or intend this to go way out of proportion on such a topic that is fragile if not contemplated correctly, and that is so controversial especially in her trial with the issue.

Her and I are in the same boat on the matter. We both know what's right and we both sometimes "go our own way" on this issue. We have the solid proof on one side spiritually and we have the carnal "justification" on the other side. It is a war in it's own sense.

[Cashodeen]

Originally posted by RWCTV


I will word my response in a different way:

AIDS is definately a risk, and having sex (without thinking of the consequences that might arise) will run your risks higher if you engage in it. When I mentioned marriage in the bible, think about this: How many married people get AIDS from each other? The reason that the bible says that you should to be married to have sex is because God does NOT want you to play around and possibly contract one of the earthbound consequences that come ouf of the risks that result in your actions. You may have sex with people and not contract something, but you are gambling with your life when you engage in what the bible refers to immoral sex, and God does not want people to hurt themselves. If I slept around my risks would be higher and higher, especially if I didn't know how may people my partner slept with. If my partner had sex with 20 people, and I just slept with that person, then it would be equivilent of me sleeping with 20 people as well and one or more of those people could have contracted an STD.

You said "God obviously wishes this consequence on some". God does not wish this consequence on anyone. He allows this to happen. Some people feel that it is a consequence because if you didn't engage in the act to begin with, and the disease came from that act, then you would have never contracted the disease if you hadn't participated in that act to begin with. That is why I worded it as a "Consequence".

I will even make it clearer by saying this: If you go to a grocery store and steal, then you are running the risk of getting caught, and if you do get caught, then you go to jail as the consequence.

Replying to me "contradicting myself", I do contradict myself in the sense that according to God, homosexuality is wrong. When I act on my flesh (in other words "put the rules aside") I don't have a problem with it. That is why at the very beginning I said that I have conflicting arguments on this issue. I proabably should have sent Lucy Fan a private message on this matter because I did not mean for or intend this to go way out of proportion on such a topic that is fragile if not contemplated correctly, and that is so controversial especially in her trial with the issue.

Her and I are in the same boat on the matter. We both know what's right and we both sometimes "go our own way" on this issue. We have the solid proof on one side spiritually and we have the carnal "justification" on the other side. It is a war in it's own sense.

Thanks for the post, RWCTV. I think it's help me understand better where you're coming from. You know that some people literally wish AIDS on those people because they believe God put it there for the punishment reason? I've heard that several times in the past. I couldn't get it out of my head that you were one of them, yet I was hearing you say you do not wish it on others. Well, I'm taking in what you've said, and it's over now.

I don't think it's bad you posted here publically instead of a PM to LucyFan. If nothing else, you've learned that your extra chromosome theory actually exists as a real disorder for some males. Lol. No seriously. I called it an "ingenius theory" sarcastically in the beginning, but it was actually smart you came up with it on your own without knowing before it was real.

[RWCTV]

Originally posted by Cashodeen


Thanks for the post, RWCTV. I think it's help me understand better where you're coming from. You know that some people literally wish AIDS on those people because they believe God put it there for the punishment reason? I've heard that several times in the past. I couldn't get it out of my head that you were one of them, yet I was hearing you say you do not wish it on others. Well, I'm taking in what you've said, and it's over now.


I'm happy that it's all cleared up.

For those people who wish AIDS on others is numb to the love that Jesus actually taught. When Jesus came on the scene, he did not condemn the world, but brought them the hope of salvation through him. If you run into a true wacky fundamentalist, then you might want to point out the Golden Rule.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

If a fundamental wacko wished a disease on someone else, and he ended up getting it himself, then would he like the same treatment that he dished out earlier to someone he thought "deserved it"? I think not.

People like that need to know that they can capture a lot more bees with sugar, than they can with Nutra Sweet. They need to know that they cannot show artificial love, they need to show real love, because God is love and some of these people are supposed to represent God.