The 1982-1983 season

[TVFactFan]

I never saw this season before and i was just wondering was the show worth watching after Shirley left the show? Was Lenny, Squiggy or Carmine seen more?

[britt britt]

I haven't seen that season either.

[*InThisMoment*]

Originally posted by britt britt
I haven't seen that season either.

me neither.

[AtlantaBravesFan29]

Yes,I saw the last season of Laverne and Shirley,both on ABC and in reruns as well. They should have called it "Laverne" or "The Penny Marshall Show" as well because Shirley was gone from the show(Cindy Williams was pregnant was why she left the show because the producers didn't know what to do). It just wasn't the same without Shirley in it,although the show was still doing respectable in the ratings despite being on opposite The A-Team. At least after Cindy had her baby she could have appeared as a guest star. The show still had some good episodes from the last season(the bank robbery episode where Laverne was framed was funny,even though death row isn't for bank robberies). But,I still wondered why they still called it Laverne and Shirley when Cindy Williams left.

[LucyFan]

Originally posted by BravesFan712002
Yes,I saw the last season of Laverne and Shirley,both on ABC and in reruns as well. They should have called it "Laverne" or "The Penny Marshall Show" as well because Shirley was gone from the show(Cindy Williams was pregnant was why she left the show because the producers didn't know what to do). It just wasn't the same without Shirley in it,although the show was still doing respectable in the ratings despite being on opposite The A-Team. At least after Cindy had her baby she could have appeared as a guest star. The show still had some good episodes from the last season(the bank robbery episode where Laverne was framed was funny,even though death row isn't for bank robberies). But,I still wondered why they still called it Laverne and Shirley when Cindy Williams left.
I heard different. I remember reading that the show's title was shortened to "Laverne" when Cindy Williams left. I guess Penny Marshall decided to change the title of show back or something because I also remember someone saying that she didn't want it took look like she kicked Cindy off the show.

[Sean Snow]

Originally posted by LucyFan

I heard different. I remember reading that the show's title was shortened to "Laverne" when Cindy Williams left. I guess Penny Marshall decided to change the title of show back or something because I also remember someone saying that she didn't want it took look like she kicked Cindy off the show.

The title remained the same. The TV Land/N@N pages for L&S both said that the show was renamed Laverne, but that never happened.

I have seen a few episodes (I have some on tape that I've never really bothered watching). The episodes were okay from the last season, but I missed Shirley. I hated how they ended the show with an episode that barely featured anyone other than Carmine. *shrugs*

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by LucyFan
I heard different. I remember reading that the show's title was shortened to "Laverne" when Cindy Williams left. I guess Penny Marshall decided to change the title of show back or something because I also remember someone saying that she didn't want it took look like she kicked Cindy off the show.


Well in my opinion if Shirley was gone then why not change the title of the show.

[Wizzy]

last season has some funny guest appearances by

1. Larraine Newman (in robbery episode)
2. Louise Lasser as nun (Laverne goes to a convent to repent
for being a bimbo)
3. Carrie Fisher (Laverne is a Playboy Bunny hostess)

other than that --
there is one other funny moment when Laverne is interviewing possible new roommates and her real sister RONNIE MARSHALL plays a Laverne Lookalike who comes by --( w/ initials on blouse and same nasally laugh) and ofcourse Laverne likes her.

EDNA was gone (left POP a note and ran off w/ another man)

LENNY was gone by mid-season (joined ARMY? or it was never mentioned)

That just left: Laverne, Pop, Squiggy, Carmine --and Rhonda !!!

Pop runs for Assemblyman -- and wins in a next to last episode.

Laverne gets a NASA job in testing --more salary and she can
keep the apartment to herself.

Carmine had slimmed down and was still showing off his
new bugg 80's chest alot. In final episode he sings Aquarius
from HAIR....

Squiggy and Rhonda just plod along in unfunny situations.

Laverne's last bit of physical comedy is when she takes a late night call from Carmine in last ep--he tells her he got a part in Broadway show--HAIR.
Laverne is sleeping on a blow-up raft in kiddie pool, her homemade water bed idea
-and after she hangs up from him--she rolls/falls over and gets wet.

The comedy was all wet -- and the series was over.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Wizzy
last season has some funny guest appearances by

1. Larraine Newman (in robbery episode)
2. Louise Lasser as nun (Laverne goes to a convent to repent
for being a bimbo)
3. Carrie Fisher (Laverne is a Playboy Bunny hostess)

other than that --
there is one other funny moment when Laverne is interviewing possible new roommates and her real sister RONNIE MARSHALL plays a Laverne Lookalike who comes by --( w/ initials on blouse and same nasally laugh) and ofcourse Laverne likes her.

EDNA was gone (left POP a note and ran off w/ another man)

LENNY was gone by mid-season (joined ARMY? or it was never mentioned)

That just left: Laverne, Pop, Squiggy, Carmine --and Rhonda !!!

Pop runs for Assemblyman -- and wins in a next to last episode.

Laverne gets a NASA job in testing --more salary and she can
keep the apartment to herself.

Carmine had slimmed down and was still showing off his
new bugg 80's chest alot. In final episode he sings Aquarius
from HAIR....

Squiggy and Rhonda just plod along in unfunny situations.

Laverne's last bit of physical comedy is when she takes a late night call from Carmine in last ep--he tells her he got a part in Broadway show--HAIR.
Laverne is sleeping on a blow-up raft in kiddie pool, her homemade water bed idea
-and after she hangs up from him--she rolls/falls over and gets wet.

The comedy was all wet -- and the series was over.



Oh I never that. Lenny and Edna was really gone before the last season ended? I found something out new today. Thanks for your reply

[Flash72]

It is obvious though that Shirley marrying and becoming pregnant was not necessarily meant to serve as a departure for Cindy Williams. The reason I say this is because in Cindy's last episode, the one in which Laverne and Shirley agree to stay in a department store window and due to hypnosis begin acting like chickens, it is indicated that Shirley is staying around. The episode clearly states that while Shirley is married, due to her husband Walter being shipped overseas, she would continue to live with Laverne for a year. I think the situation with Cindy and the producers resulted in this scenario changing suddenly and Shirley joining her husband overseas.

[Stuck In The '70's]

I didn't like the last season.

[MamasFamilyFan2003]

i always thought of those episodes as knock off's of Mary Tyler Moore.......i could be wrong though

[vze3t9q9]

I remember seeing the show when it was in production and that Penny did a fine job with the last season by going it alone. I gave her credit for sticking it out. I do remember it was Laverne and Shirley for part or all of the last season. When I saw that show in 1976, I thought it was so funny. I see it now and the zip is not there. It's funny how your tastes change.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by vze3t9q9
I remember seeing the show when it was in production and that Penny did a fine job with the last season by going it alone. I gave her credit for sticking it out. I do remember it was Laverne and Shirley for part or all of the last season. When I saw that show in 1976, I thought it was so funny. I see it now and the zip is not there. It's funny how your tastes change.


Probably because the show was at the time. Now it's a 27 year old show so i guess you seen every episode and that's why it's no zip.

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by Wizzy
last season has some funny guest appearances by

1. Larraine Newman (in robbery episode)
2. Louise Lasser as nun (Laverne goes to a convent to repent
for being a bimbo)
3. Carrie Fisher (Laverne is a Playboy Bunny hostess)

other than that --
there is one other funny moment when Laverne is interviewing possible new roommates and her real sister RONNIE MARSHALL plays a Laverne Lookalike who comes by --( w/ initials on blouse and same nasally laugh) and ofcourse Laverne likes her.

EDNA was gone (left POP a note and ran off w/ another man)


I didn't watch the final season that much when it was first aired nor in reruns, so I don't remember Edna leaving Laverne's pop. Could you elaborate on this - give the reason why she left? Was it something they built up to, or was it just an abrupt departure?

Thanks!

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Dr. Thong
I didn't watch the final season that much when it was first aired nor in reruns, so I don't remember Edna leaving Laverne's pop. Could you elaborate on this - give the reason why she left? Was it something they built up to, or was it just an abrupt departure?

Thanks!


That's a WaCKY departure for Edna to run off with another man.

[Joeytrom]

Edna was last seen during the 1980-1981 season (first year in California). She was only referred to in the next two seasons. In the last season, they air episodes out of order as Laverne arranges a blind date for her father in one episode and a few weeks later Frank tells Laverne that Edna left him!

As Betty Garrett had left the series, they should have just killed Edna off instead of they way they wrote the character out. It didn't seem right.

[AtlantaBravesFan29]

Originally posted by Flash72
It is obvious though that Shirley marrying and becoming pregnant was not necessarily meant to serve as a departure for Cindy Williams. The reason I say this is because in Cindy's last episode, the one in which Laverne and Shirley agree to stay in a department store window and due to hypnosis begin acting like chickens, it is indicated that Shirley is staying around. The episode clearly states that while Shirley is married, due to her husband Walter being shipped overseas, she would continue to live with Laverne for a year. I think the situation with Cindy and the producers resulted in this scenario changing suddenly and Shirley joining her husband overseas. Cindy Williams was pregnant in real life not her character which meant the producers had to do something thus Shirley joining her husband overseas and Cindy leaving the show.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by BravesFan712002
Cindy Williams was pregnant in real life not her character.


I don't think I ever saw the last season. Which is why I'm glad L&S is coming to Lifetime in March.

[Flash72]

Originally posted by BravesFan712002
Cindy Williams was pregnant in real life not her character which meant the producers had to do something thus Shirley joining her husband overseas and Cindy leaving the show.



I have to defend my statement in saying that while Cindy was pregnant in real life, her character on the show was as well. If some station ever airs the series again, you will see this to be true.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Flash72
I have to defend my statement in saying that while Cindy was pregnant in real life, her character on the show was as well. If some station ever airs the series again, you will see this to be true.


Well i will find out in 2004 since L&S is coming to Lifetime. With two episodes a day, i would say the last season will be on around May

[AtlantaBravesFan29]

I have just learned something through the TVTOME site that Cindy appeared in the first 2 episodes of the last season. The first one was the episode where she married Walter Meeny,the second one,the last one that Cindy was in was the episode where they are demonstrating the house of the future at the department store.It goes into further detail about Shirley being a roommate for a year because of Walter going into the military. Then in the 3rd episode,that was when Laverne finds out that Shirley had left a note saying that she was going overseas to be with Walter.

I guess I must have missed the part about Shirley being pregnant,it has been quite a while since I have watched Laverne and Shirley.I know of the episode where they are demonstrating the house of the future. Thanks for clarifying in detail.

[TV Guy]

When Cindy became pregnant in real life, the original plan was to have Shirley become pregnant as well and continue living with Laverne while her husband was overseas. That's why Shirley announces she's pregnant at the end of her last episode (the one where they live in the house of the future). The producers knew that the show was running out of gas and hoped that the baby would give them some material for new storylines.

But Cindy and the producers had a disagreement over her schedule and her compensation -- the producers felt that if Cindy was going to work less, then she should be paid less. Cindy disagreed, and wound up leaving abruptly after filming the second episode of the 82-83 season. That's why Shirley was quickly written out of the show -- she doesn't even appear in the episode where Shirley's departure is explained.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by TV Guy
When Cindy became pregnant in real life, the original plan was to have Shirley become pregnant as well and continue living with Laverne while her husband was overseas. That's why Shirley announces she's pregnant at the end of her last episode (the one where they live in the house of the future). The producers knew that the show was running out of gas and hoped that the baby would give them some material for new storylines.

But Cindy and the producers had a disagreement over her schedule and her compensation -- the producers felt that if Cindy was going to work less, then she should be paid less. Cindy disagreed, and wound up leaving abruptly after filming the second episode of the 82-83 season. That's why Shirley was quickly written out of the show -- she doesn't even appear in the episode where Shirley's departure is explained.



Cindy said she didn;t want more money, she just wanted her hours in writing and she said the producers refused. Then she said the producers stated she couldn't do the job because she was pregnant.

[TV Guy]

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
Cindy said she didn;t want more money, she just wanted her hours in writing and she said the producers refused. Then she said the producers stated she couldn't do the job because she was pregnant.

Cindy didn't ask for more money -- the producers wanted to reduce her salary in exchange for reducing her working hours. She wanted to make the same amount of money she was making before.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by TV Guy
Cindy didn't ask for more money -- the producers wanted to reduce her salary in exchange for reducing her working hours. She wanted to make the same amount of money she was making before.


Well that's what Cindy said in a 1982 TV Guide Interview She said she did not want more money.

[TV Guy]

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
Well that's what Cindy said in a 1982 TV Guide Interview She said she did not want more money.

No, she didn't want more money, but she didn't want to take a salary cut, either, and that's what Garry Marshall wanted her to do in exchange for the reduced schedule. At least that was what was being reported in the press at the time. But ultimately, only the parties involved know what really happened.

[bb25]

I've seen some eps from the last season, and they're not really bad. I'm not a big fan of the California eps, so of course I'm not going to love the last season...it will be interesting to see again though...

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by bb25
I've seen some eps from the last season, and they're not really bad. I'm not a big fan of the California eps, so of course I'm not going to love the last season...it will be interesting to see again though...

The one with Carrie Fisher wasn't bad, but Shirley leaving the show was the final nail in the coffin. Laverne alone is like the sound of one hand clapping.:eek:

[Rockapella722]

Last season stunk, don't even bother.

Lenny was gone, Shirley was gone... no magic left. I never watch those episodes.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Rockapella722
Last season stunk, don't even bother.

Lenny was gone, Shirley was gone... no magic left. I never watch those episodes.


Lenny was GONE TOO?

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Rockapella722
Last season stunk, don't even bother.

Lenny was gone, Shirley was gone... no magic left. I never watch those episodes.

I read the episode guide for seasons 7 and 8 and i didn't see anything about Lenny leaving. Unless the editor for the guide hasn;t seen every episode

[Stuck In The '70's]

Lenny never left the show. Him and Squiggy were added to the opening credits after Cindy Williams left the show.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by mr roper
Lenny never left the show. Him and Squiggy were added to the opening credits after Cindy Williams left the show.


I thought the were always in the opening credits?

[Stuck In The '70's]

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
I thought the were always in the opening credits?
They had pictures of the cast during the opening credits but the actors names were never listed. Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were the only 2 people to have their names in the opening credits until the last season.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by mr roper

They had pictures of the cast during the opening credits but the actors names were never listed. Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were the only 2 people to have their names in the opening credits until the last season.


I still don't understand-LOL

[Stuck In The '70's]

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
I still don't understand-LOL
Its like on the Mary Tyler Moore Show were the cast has its pictures in the opening credits but the actors names don't appear until the show goes off. On Laverne And Shirley Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were the only 2 cast members to be billed in the opening credits. Their were pictures during the years of Lenny, Squiggy, Carmine, Frank and Edna during the opening credits but the actors names weren't listed until the closing credits.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by mr roper

Its like on the Mary Tyler Moore Show were the cast has its pictures in the opening credits but the actors names don't appear until the show goes off. On Laverne And Shirley Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were the only 2 cast members to be billed in the opening credits. Their were pictures during the years of Lenny, Squiggy, Carmine, Frank and Edna during the opening credits but the actors names weren't listed until the closing credits.

Thanks.

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by mr roper

Its like on the Mary Tyler Moore Show were the cast has its pictures in the opening credits but the actors names don't appear until the show goes off. On Laverne And Shirley Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams were the only 2 cast members to be billed in the opening credits. Their were pictures during the years of Lenny, Squiggy, Carmine, Frank and Edna during the opening credits but the actors names weren't listed until the closing credits.

I always thought that was a big ego thing. To me, its the supporting cast that makes or breaks a show - especially Lenny & Squiggy in this case...:happyface

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Dr. Thong
I always thought that was a big ego thing. To me, its the supporting cast that makes or breaks a show - especially Lenny & Squiggy in this case...:happyface


I watched the show because I was ATTRACTED to Shirley and Lenny and Squiggy were STUPID Funny. Never watched it to see Laverne

[Stuck In The '70's]

Originally posted by Dr. Thong
I always thought that was a big ego thing. To me, its the supporting cast that makes or breaks a show - especially Lenny & Squiggy in this case...:happyface
It was all ego. Penny and cindy were given equal billing and I even read somewhere that they each wanted the same number of lines for each episode. Their was a lot of tension behind the scenes on that show.:lol:

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by mr roper

It was all ego. Penny and cindy were given equal billing and I even read somewhere that they each wanted the same number of lines for each episode. Their was a lot of tension behind the scenes on that show.:lol:

If you notice, I forget who's name appears "first" in the credits, but the "second-billed" star's name appears higher in the frame. Kind of a way to "balance" the billing, maybe??

It's funny in a sad way, but at least Penny and Cindy reconciled in real life. Just too bad the show couldn't have had a proper final episode with the cast intact.:rolleyes:

[TV Guy]

Originally posted by Dr. Thong
If you notice, I forget who's name appears "first" in the credits, but the "second-billed" star's name appears higher in the frame. Kind of a way to "balance" the billing, maybe??


Yeah, it's known in the industry as "cross-billing" and it's supposed to be equal -- a different actor's name comes first whether you read it left-to-right or top-to-bottom. Other cross-billed actors: Ted Danson and Shelley Long on "Cheers", Tyne Daly and Sharon Gless on "Cagney and Lacey" (until they simply started alternating top billing), and Eric McCormack and Debra Messing on "WIll & Grace". There are other examples as well.

As far as the supporting actors not being credited in the opening -- I doubt that was Penny and Cindy's decision. They didn't have that kind of clout in the early days of the show. If anyone made that call, it was Garry Marshall. Perhaps he wanted to simply emphasize his title stars. Or maybe the supporting cast didn't have agents who insisted on upfront billing.

[Brian]

Originally posted by TV Guy
Yeah, it's known in the industry as "cross-billing" and it's supposed to be equal -- a different actor's name comes first whether you read it left-to-right or top-to-bottom. Other cross-billed actors: Ted Danson and Shelley Long on "Cheers", Tyne Daly and Sharon Gless on "Cagney and Lacey" (until they simply started alternating top billing), and Eric McCormack and Debra Messing on "WIll & Grace". There are other examples as well.



I believe that kind of billing was invented in the film industry. In the movie "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid", it was originally going to star Steve McQueen and Paul Newman. McQueen dropped out because he didn't like the idea of this kind of billing. A few years later, though, he and Newman starred in The Towering Inferno and their names were given cross-billing (at McQueen's insistence).

Back on topic, I have to agree with Dr. Thong. I think that this was a show that shouldn't have ended with "unfinished business." A great series finale with the cast from over the years (like Happy Days' finale) would have been a great finish to an otherwise mediocre final season.

[TV Guy]

Every time I see one of those late eighth season episodes with only Penny Marshall and David L. Lander credited in the opening, I reach for the remote. They should have renamed those episodes "Laverne & Squiggy". :)

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by Brian
Back on topic, I have to agree with Dr. Thong. I think that this was a show that shouldn't have ended with "unfinished business." A great series finale with the cast from over the years (like Happy Days' finale) would have been a great finish to an otherwise mediocre final season.

The Happy Days finale was missing Anson Williams (Potsie) and Donny Most (Ralph). On the other hand, they had Ron Howard and if he'd been missing from the finale, it would have been far more noticeable.

Thanks for concurring with me, Brian - the same thing happened ("unfinished business") with Archie Bunker's Place the same year! To this day, Danielle Brisbois (Stephanie) complains that they pulled the rug out from under them and disrespected a beloved character who'd entertained audiences for 12 years. The late Carroll O' Connor deserved better than that...

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by TV Guy
Every time I see one of those late eighth season episodes with only Penny Marshall and David L. Lander credited in the opening, I reach for the remote. They should have renamed those episodes "Laverne & Squiggy". :)

Yes!

LOL! :lol:

[TV Guy]

Originally posted by Dr. Thong

Thanks for concurring with me, Brian - the same thing happened ("unfinished business") with Archie Bunker's Place the same year! To this day, Danielle Brisbois (Stephanie) complains that they pulled the rug out from under them and disrespected a beloved character who'd entertained audiences for 12 years. The late Carroll O' Connor deserved better than that...

Unfortuately, that's the risk you run when you run a series into the ground, such as what happened with "L&S" and "Archie Bunker's Place". CBS actually gave Carroll the option of saying that he was ending the series, but he refused, because he didn't want to be the one responsible for putting people out of work. It would have been nice if the producers of both of these shows recognized during their final seasons that the ratings were really falling and it was time to wrap things up. But they held out hope for another year, and lost their chance to do a series finale that brought some closure.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by TV Guy
Unfortuately, that's the risk you run when you run a series into the ground, such as what happened with "L&S" and "Archie Bunker's Place". CBS actually gave Carroll the option of saying that he was ending the series, but he refused, because he didn't want to be the one responsible for putting people out of work. It would have been nice if the producers of both of these shows recognized during their final seasons that the ratings were really falling and it was time to wrap things up. But they held out hope for another year, and lost their chance to do a series finale that brought some closure.


Surprisingly L&S finished #20 in it's last season.

[JAJones]

Originally posted by Sitcom Analyzer
Surprisingly L&S finished #20 in it's last season.

No, it was 25th, and the ratings were much lower at the end of the season than at the beginning. The A-Team came on in the middle of the year and was clobbering it. The final episodes weren't even in the top 30 and everyone knew it was the end.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by JAJones
No, it was 25th, and the ratings were much lower at the end of the season than at the beginning. The A-Team came on in the middle of the year and was clobbering it. The final episodes weren't even in the top 30 and everyone knew it was the end.



i just know the show lost something when the setting switched to california. I couldn;t put my finger on it but it lost something.

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by TV Guy
Unfortuately, that's the risk you run when you run a series into the ground, such as what happened with "L&S" and "Archie Bunker's Place". CBS actually gave Carroll the option of saying that he was ending the series, but he refused, because he didn't want to be the one responsible for putting people out of work. It would have been nice if the producers of both of these shows recognized during their final seasons that the ratings were really falling and it was time to wrap things up. But they held out hope for another year, and lost their chance to do a series finale that brought some closure.

True. However, Archie Bunker's Place finished ahead of other shows like The Dukes Of Hazzard, which had significantly lower ratings, yet was renewed for the following season. It has been implied that one of the Warner Bros. execs had a connection with one of the programming chiefs at CBS or had himself been a one-time programming person at CBS.

Makes you wonder..

At any rate, they should have retired Archie and Edith when Mike and Gloria moved to California and let that be the end of the series.

:(

[TV Guy]

I've heard that about the CBS programming chief (I think it was Robert Daly) at that time. But you'll always find some cancelled shows that rank higher than rewnewed shows. It's about more than just simple rankings -- it's about context.

A network might consider a top-25 show on Friday night, when audience levels are low, to be a hit. But a top-25 show that follows a top-5 show on Thursday night will be a candidate for cancellation, because it's losing too much of its lead-in (look at all those cancelled shows that followed "Friends"). Momentum is taken into account as well: a show that has moved up from number 40 to number 30 will probably get renewed, while a show that has dropped from number 20 to number 30 may get cancelled, especially if it is an older, more expensive show that is past its peak creatively. Network programmers look at more than just rankings when making these decisions.

In the case of "The Dukes of Hazzard", the 1982-83 season was the one where the two leads were replaced temporarily due to a contract dispute. The original leads returned at the end of the season and the ratings spiked. But the final ranking for the season was lower than the previous year due to the absence of the two stars for most of the year. CBS took this into account when making its decision to renew the show.

"Archie," meanwhile, was moved off of Sunday night in mid-season because it was losing too much audience from its lead-in, "60 Minutes", which was the number 1 show at the time. When "Archie" moved to Mondays, its ratings fell even further. CBS saw it as an aging, expensive, creatively-spent show and felt that it had no place to go but down. Frankly, I think Carroll O'Connor should have seen it coming and made the call himself, so there could have been a series finale, but that's just my opinion.

I agree with you that the show should have ended with "The Stivics Move West", which would have ranked as one of the best series finales ever, IMHO.

[Dr. Thong]

Originally posted by TV Guy
"Archie," meanwhile, was moved off of Sunday night in mid-season because it was losing too much audience from its lead-in, "60 Minutes", which was the number 1 show at the time. When "Archie" moved to Mondays, its ratings fell even further. CBS saw it as an aging, expensive, creatively-spent show and felt that it had no place to go but down. Frankly, I think Carroll O'Connor should have seen it coming and made the call himself, so there could have been a series finale, but that's just my opinion.

I agree with you that the show should have ended with "The Stivics Move West", which would have ranked as one of the best series finales ever, IMHO.

TV Guy,

You make some excellent points here. For me, Archie's Place began its decline when Martin Balsam left. Once Murray was gone, Archie had no one to spar with and became soft.

The show was basically done and things happen for a reason, but O' Connor probably didn't want to admit it was over. Oh well, we still have the classic All In The Family reruns and in those, Archie will always remain in his prime.

[tiff7]

The show wasn't the same when Shirley, Lenny & Edna left. Yes, Cindy left 'cause she was going 2 have a baby, the priducers wanted 2 give her more money, but she left the show & sued them so million dollars. Betty left 'cause she was going 2 do another play. Michael left for 6 eps 2 do "Spinal Tap". That's my final answer!

Tiff7