Why I feel the Gloria character should have stayed away like Mike Stivic

[TVFactFan]

I'm sittimg here looking at how pathetic the Gloria character looks in this two-part episode. Mike leaves her and now she is a single mother with no job and doesn't know what the direction to go in. She is crying and moaning while Mike is hooked up with a home coming Queen. Couldn't she jus have stayed away from ABP like Rob Reiner did? I thought when Mike and Gloria moved to California, that was the end of those characters. That's why I'm trying to figure out why Sally Struthers returned if she was written off. Maybe she had no other gigs.

[DarleneIllyria]

Originally posted by SOLOMON
Maybe she had no other gigs.

I think that's what it was. Rob and Sally were both geared up to leave AITF to get other projects. Sally didn't have much success, I suppose.

The Sally episodes from today were okay. I thought Gloria would've taken the whole thing more strongly. Gloria was such a strong character on AITF. Then again, I suppose even the strong people are shook up when their marriage ends.

[jon123]

After this episode (not counting "Gloria, the First Day" which will be shown today but was never aired originally on ABP) Gloria did stay away from ABP. I remember how disappointed I was that there were no crossovers between Gloria and ABP during the season Gloria was on, and guess what, at the end of that season both shows were cancelled. I applaud Gloria's decision to make it on her own but from the show's standpoint, it would have been better if she had stayed with Archie (or maybe moved back next door). At least she made this one guest appearance, while she had left the show the character is still Archie's daughter and it made sense for her to visit from time to time. I thought the Gloria series was awful and perhaps another alternative would have to keep Mike and Gloria together(and spare us that rediculous commune) and have Gloria and Joey visit more often but without Mike if Rob Reiner did not want to appear.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by jon123
After this episode (not counting "Gloria, the First Day" which will be shown today but was never aired originally on ABP) Gloria did stay away from ABP. I remember how disappointed I was that there were no crossovers between Gloria and ABP during the season Gloria was on, and guess what, at the end of that season both shows were cancelled. I applaud Gloria's decision to make it on her own but from the show's standpoint, it would have been better if she had stayed with Archie (or maybe moved back next door). At least she made this one guest appearance, while she had left the show the character is still Archie's daughter and it made sense for her to visit from time to time. I thought the Gloria series was awful and perhaps another alternative would have to keep Mike and Gloria together(and spare us that rediculous commune) and have Gloria and Joey visit more often but without Mike if Rob Reiner did not want to appear.




It's just amazing that Archie never appered on none of the AITF spinoffs. But i think the Gloria episode TV LAND is showing today is the one they showed back in the fall-I could be wrong.

[DarleneIllyria]

Originally posted by jon123
After this episode (not counting "Gloria, the First Day" which will be shown today but was never aired originally on ABP) Gloria did stay away from ABP. I remember how disappointed I was that there were no crossovers between Gloria and ABP during the season Gloria was on, and guess what, at the end of that season both shows were cancelled. I applaud Gloria's decision to make it on her own but from the show's standpoint, it would have been better if she had stayed with Archie (or maybe moved back next door). At least she made this one guest appearance, while she had left the show the character is still Archie's daughter and it made sense for her to visit from time to time. I thought the Gloria series was awful and perhaps another alternative would have to keep Mike and Gloria together(and spare us that rediculous commune) and have Gloria and Joey visit more often but without Mike if Rob Reiner did not want to appear.

Both shows were canceled at the same time? It's a shame they couldn't get Rob back for at least one more episode of ABP. I hated that final episode of Archie Bunker's Place. I absolutely hated it. They could've had Gloria move next door (like you said) and then Mike leave the commune and try to win back Gloria. That would've been a good ending.

I don't know about you guys, but it just looked so lonely to see Gloria and Archie in that episode. Edith's dead and Mike's left, we'll never see the gang back together again. That's what really sucks.

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by Jenny


Both shows were canceled at the same time? It's a shame they couldn't get Rob back for at least one more episode of ABP. I hated that final episode of Archie Bunker's Place. I absolutely hated it. They could've had Gloria move next door (like you said) and then Mike leave the commune and try to win back Gloria. That would've been a good ending.

I don't know about you guys, but it just looked so lonely to see Gloria and Archie in that episode. Edith's dead and Mike's left, we'll never see the gang back together again. That's what really sucks.


I just don't know how the producers thought a show that revolved around the Gloria character would last. I mean Gloria wasn't really a character that entertained the viewers of AITF which is why her show didn't last. That's like giving Maude's daughter Carol her own show or Giving Lionel Jefferson his own show.

[jon123]

I almost would have rather seen a show with Carol or Lionel by themselves. Even my pets thought this episode stunk.

It's strange that while Mike moved to a commune, Gloria didn't really have her own space and privacy at her digs either. For once I wish Archie was right (when he said Gloria wouldn't make it at Dr. Adams' place). Gloria and Joey could have moved into Archie's basement and been better off. If anything was worse than seeing Archie without the rest of his original family, it was seeing Gloria without the family.

Had Gloria just joined the cast of ABP instead of her own show she could also interact with Billie and Stephanie and gang up on Archie and it would have been great. They could have eliminated or reduced the role of some of the characters at the bar and the result would have been a better show overall and it may have lasted a few more years.

As sad as it was just seeing Archie and Gloria left, we have the happy memories of AITF early years that will be with us in rerun heaven forever.

[El_Presidente]

They should have made a spinoff with the blind old dude tryng to pur a glass of water into a cup on top of a washing macine in use.
Each episode they'd focus on the people interrupting his attempts, as well as special gues stars such as Andrea Bocelli, Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Bob the Pencil salesman from 86th and Lexington.

[db108108]

Archie did appear in one of the spin-offs. The first time I remember seeing his character was in an episode of Maude

[TVFactFan]

Originally posted by db108108
Archie did appear in one of the spin-offs. The first time I remember seeing his character was in an episode of Maude

The character Archie Bunker never appeared on any of the All in the Family Spinoffs. He appeared in the pilot of Maude which was aAll in the Family episode. Never apperaed on Maude once the show premeired in the fall of 1972.

[TJAMES03]

Archie did appear in one of the spin-offs. The first time I remember seeing his character was in an episode of Maude

No, Archie was never on Maude. Don't get confused with some episodes of The Jeffersons either. When Archie was at their "deluxe apartment" it was only on "AITF." Archie and Edith appeared in the flashbacks of Loiuse and George in a later season, but that is it.

[An 80s Guy]

if Mike and Gloria was split up how come they both went to spend Thanksgiving with the Bunkers

[TVFactFan]

No, Archie was never on Maude. Don't get confused with some episodes of The Jeffersons either. When Archie was at their "deluxe apartment" it was only on "AITF." Archie and Edith appeared in the flashbacks of Loiuse and George in a later season, but that is it.


Archie was never at the Jeffersons APT, he was just referred to

[JeffRuss1972]

I hated how they dealt with the Mike character leaving Gloria and Joey. It always seemed tacky. Always caught myself thinking "Mike would never do THAT." I prefer to think of them all as they were on AITF.

[An 80s Guy]

yeah me too

[TVFactFan]

I hated how they dealt with the Mike character leaving Gloria and Joey. It always seemed tacky. Always caught myself thinking "Mike would never do THAT." I prefer to think of them all as they were on AITF.


Well I guess Rob Reiner was able to find work and Sally Struthers wasn't-lol

[Edster2973]

It's just amazing that Archie never appered on none of the AITF spinoffs.


This is just a stab in the dark but I'd bet the reason why Carroll O'Connor never guest-starred on any of the spin-offs is simply because the other shows couldn't afford to have him on. As All in the Family got more popular, Carroll's check increased as well, and you can bet that if, say, Maude wanted Carroll to guest-star, he'd want them to pay enough for it. Carroll would've interpreted the 'guest-spot' as an effort of CBS's to save one of the spin-offs, and he most definitely would've wanted to be compensated for it. I think that's why he didn't even appear on Gloria or The Jeffersons because it would've cost CBS too much for him to appear.

And it's probably why none of the spin-off characters really guest-starred that often after their respective shows got started, simply because those spin-off actors were now getting top-star billing, and in order for CBS to afford them to appear on All in the Family/Archie Bunker's Place, the actors (who were used to being the star on their own shows, even if, like Gloria, it wasn't a hit) would have to agree to be paid less than they were on their own shows. Like Carroll, they'd want to be compensated monetarily for making even a guest-appearance, especially if they thought that by doing so it would raise the ratings.

From a business sense, I don't think CBS was willing to shell out that much money. Whether they really could afford to, or whether Carroll and the others were worth that much, is not my argument. I just think that with CBS's history of trying to talk Carroll O'Connor down from a raise that he fought very hard for, it's not too much of a stretch to think that CBS would've been more miserly with potential guest-appearances.

I think that's why no one from the past showed up during "Archie Alone" and why Edith's death took place one month after it happened, simply because having all of those actors in one place would've been too expensive for CBS.

Just call it a hunch...


Ed

[TVFactFan]

This is just a stab in the dark but I'd bet the reason why Carroll O'Connor never guest-starred on any of the spin-offs is simply because the other shows couldn't afford to have him on. As All in the Family got more popular, Carroll's check increased as well, and you can bet that if, say, Maude wanted Carroll to guest-star, he'd want them to pay enough for it. Carroll would've interpreted the 'guest-spot' as an effort of CBS's to save one of the spin-offs, and he most definitely would've wanted to be compensated for it. I think that's why he didn't even appear on Gloria or The Jeffersons because it would've cost CBS too much for him to appear.

And it's probably why none of the spin-off characters really guest-starred that often after their respective shows got started, simply because those spin-off actors were now getting top-star billing, and in order for CBS to afford them to appear on All in the Family/Archie Bunker's Place, the actors (who were used to being the star on their own shows, even if, like Gloria, it wasn't a hit) would have to agree to be paid less than they were on their own shows. Like Carroll, they'd want to be compensated monetarily for making even a guest-appearance, especially if they thought that by doing so it would raise the ratings.

From a business sense, I don't think CBS was willing to shell out that much money. Whether they really could afford to, or whether Carroll and the others were worth that much, is not my argument. I just think that with CBS's history of trying to talk Carroll O'Connor down from a raise that he fought very hard for, it's not too much of a stretch to think that CBS would've been more miserly with potential guest-appearances.

I think that's why no one from the past showed up during "Archie Alone" and why Edith's death took place one month after it happened, simply because having all of those actors in one place would've been too expensive for CBS.

Just call it a hunch...


Ed



Well if that's the case then Sheman hemsley and Isabel sanford shouldn;t have RETURNED to All In the family to make a guest apperance

[Edster2973]

Well if that's the case then Sheman hemsley and Isabel sanford shouldn;t have RETURNED to All In the family to make a guest apperance

First of all, I said it was a hunch, which means I guessed, and I still stand by that guess actually. I think, at least on Carroll O'Connor's part, money was an issue. I can't see him doing guest-stints and agreeing not to be paid amply for it. And since CBS tried to screw him time and time again, I wouldn't put it past CBS to not think he was worth it. I could be wrong, but until someone proves otherwise, I stand by my guess.

For Isabel Sanford and Sherman Helmsley, maybe it was different for them. Perhaps they weren't paid nearly as much as Carroll O'Connor was, even when they were stars on their own show. Carroll's involvement with the show intensified with him contributing to scripts and directing, which had to have upped his pay raise. Perhaps Sanford & Helmsley weren't nearly as expensive, or perhaps they were willing to do a guest-stint for 'old times sake'.

BTW, which episode did they guest-star on? I don't recall seeing them on the show once they left.

Ed

[Edster2973]

Well if that's the case then Sheman hemsley and Isabel sanford shouldn;t have RETURNED to All In the family to make a guest apperance

First of all, I said it was a hunch, which means I guessed, and I still stand by that guess actually. I think, at least on Carroll O'Connor's part, money was an issue. I can't see him doing guest-stints and agreeing not to be paid amply for it. And since CBS tried to screw him time and time again, I wouldn't put it past CBS to not think he was worth it. I could be wrong, but until someone proves otherwise, I stand by my guess.

For Isabel Sanford and Sherman Helmsley, maybe it was different for them. Perhaps they weren't paid nearly as much as Carroll O'Connor was, even when they were stars on their own show. Carroll's involvement with the show intensified with him contributing to scripts and directing, which had to have upped his pay raise. Perhaps Sanford & Helmsley weren't nearly as expensive, or perhaps they were willing to do a guest-stint for 'old times sake'.

BTW, which episode did they guest-star on? I don't recall seeing them on the show once they left.

Ed

[TVFactFan]

First of all, I said it was a hunch, which means I guessed, and I still stand by that guess actually. I think, at least on Carroll O'Connor's part, money was an issue. I can't see him doing guest-stints and agreeing not to be paid amply for it. And since CBS tried to screw him time and time again, I wouldn't put it past CBS to not think he was worth it. I could be wrong, but until someone proves otherwise, I stand by my guess.

For Isabel Sanford and Sherman Helmsley, maybe it was different for them. Perhaps they weren't paid nearly as much as Carroll O'Connor was, even when they were stars on their own show. Carroll's involvement with the show intensified with him contributing to scripts and directing, which had to have upped his pay raise. Perhaps Sanford & Helmsley weren't nearly as expensive, or perhaps they were willing to do a guest-stint for 'old times sake'.

BTW, which episode did they guest-star on? I don't recall seeing them on the show once they left.

Ed



Sherman Hemsley guest starred in Mike's New Job in the spring of 1978 and Isabel Sanford guest starred in The Family Next Door in the spring of 1979

[Edster2973]

Sherman Hemsley guest starred in Mike's New Job in the spring of 1978 and Isabel Sanford guest starred in The Family Next Door in the spring of 1979

Interestingly, they didn't appear together. Why is that I wonder? Again, maybe they were too expensive to appear as a couple. Maybe not. But can you at least see why it's not always possible to have every former cast member appear, even if their absences is a glaring hole in continuity? It's not right, but in Hollywood, business is business.

Ed

[TVFactFan]

Interestingly, they didn't appear together. Why is that I wonder? Again, maybe they were too expensive to appear as a couple. Maybe not. But can you at least see why it's not always possible to have every former cast member appear, even if their absences is a glaring hole in continuity? It's not right, but in Hollywood, business is business.

Ed


Yes that was ODD for them not to appear together. But couldn't Edith had appear on the Jeffersons alone since she was Louise's best friend? It really wouldn't have been no need for Archie to appear since he was not liked by George or Louise

[comedyfreak]

Had Gloria just joined the cast of ABP instead of her own show she could also interact with Billie and Stephanie and gang up on Archie and it would have been great. They could have eliminated or reduced the role of some of the characters at the bar and the result would have been a better show overall and it may have lasted a few more years.

As sad as it was just seeing Archie and Gloria left, we have the happy memories of AITF early years that will be with us in rerun heaven forever.
I agree and like this idea, it would have rejuvenated ABP.

I also think they should have given Gloria a different format. They should have had Gloria moving back to NY to live with her best friend Trudy, who would help her readjust to single life.

[TVFactFan]

I agree and like this idea, it would have rejuvenated ABP.

I also think they should have given Gloria a different format. They should have had Gloria moving back to NY to live with her best friend Trudy, who would help her readjust to single life.


I know instead of having her living way up in a wooded area. I was turned off by the setting of the show when I first watched the opening credits. Was she supposed to be living in Upstate New York?

[APPLEI]

Well I guess Rob Reiner was able to find work and Sally Struthers wasn't-lol

Rob Reiner said in an interview that both he and Sally Struthers were offered roles in ARCHIE BUNKERS PLACE for the third season after martin balsam(murry klein) quit .

both he and Sally were offered a huge saleries and a share of the profits and said he was very close to accepting but turned it down to because he wanted to direct movies.
the third season is when Denise Miller(billie bunker) & Barry Gordon(gary rabinowitz) joined the cast inPLACE of the mike and gloria characters.

thats when producers decided to create the GLORIA spin off and "divorce" the mike stivic character off.
rob reiner was quoted as saying it was a big gamble that paid off in the long run.

[TVFactFan]

Rob Reiner said in an interview that both he and Sally Struthers were offered roles in ARCHIE BUNKERS PLACE for the third season after martin balsam(murry klein) quit .

both he and Sally were offered a huge saleries and a share of the profits and said he was very close to accepting but turned it down to because he wanted to direct movies.
the third season is when Denise Miller(billie bunker) & Barry Gordon(gary rabinowitz) joined the cast inPLACE of the mike and gloria characters.

thats when producers decided to create the GLORIA spin off and "divorce" the mike stivic character off.
rob reiner was quoted as saying it was a big gamble that paid off in the long run.



I might have liked Gloria better if Mike was on there

[Edster2973]

Yes that was ODD for them not to appear together. But couldn't Edith had appear on the Jeffersons alone since she was Louise's best friend? It really wouldn't have been no need for Archie to appear since he was not liked by George or Louise

You really haven't quite grasped what I've been getting at, have you Solomon. Yes, it would make the most sense for Edith to have appeared on The Jeffersons, but again, Jean Stapleton, while not being paid as much as Carroll O'Connor, would've been quite expensive to have appeared on the show. Plus, they would have to come up with a decent storyline to justify the expense. No way would CBS have Edith show up just to say 'hi'.
Would it have been nice to see? You bet, but there's a business side to this that we mustn't forget, and Jean Stapleton would've been almost as expensive to have appeared on The Jeffersons as Carroll O'Connor. So that's probably why it never materialized.

Plus the fact that Jean Stapleton practically wanted out of All in the Family once Sally Struthers & Rob Reiner left, but she hung on with the expectation that the next season would indeed be the last. She clearly was burned out and wanted nothing to do with the regular series, let alone making extra appearances on the other spin-offs.

Again, the only way to probably achieve this was to have thrown more money at her, something that was attempted for the second season of Archie Bunker's Place. When that failed, they killed her off.

If she was tired of making regular appearances, do you think she'd even want to make a guest-appearance anywhere else as Edith?


See my point??????????


Ed

[TVFactFan]

You really haven't quite grasped what I've been getting at, have you Solomon. Yes, it would make the most sense for Edith to have appeared on The Jeffersons, but again, Jean Stapleton, while not being paid as much as Carroll O'Connor, would've been quite expensive to have appeared on the show. Plus, they would have to come up with a decent storyline to justify the expense. No way would CBS have Edith show up just to say 'hi'.
Would it have been nice to see? You bet, but there's a business side to this that we mustn't forget, and Jean Stapleton would've been almost as expensive to have appeared on The Jeffersons as Carroll O'Connor. So that's probably why it never materialized.

Plus the fact that Jean Stapleton practically wanted out of All in the Family once Sally Struthers & Rob Reiner left, but she hung on with the expectation that the next season would indeed be the last. She clearly was burned out and wanted nothing to do with the regular series, let alone making extra appearances on the other spin-offs.

Again, the only way to probably achieve this was to have thrown more money at her, something that was attempted for the second season of Archie Bunker's Place. When that failed, they killed her off.

If she was tired of making regular appearances, do you think she'd even want to make a guest-appearance anywhere else as Edith?


See my point??????????


Ed



What about Mike Visting Lionel?

[comedyfreak]

Was she supposed to be living in Upstate New York?
I'm not sure. Sometimes us fans are the ones who could do a better job of formatting shows.

[TVFactFan]

I'm not sure. Sometimes us fans are the ones who could do a better job of formatting shows.


The opening theme song combined with her and little joey standing in the midde of nowhere trying to move ahead in life was so depessing-lol

[magellan333]

First of all, I said it was a hunch, which means I guessed, and I still stand by that guess actually. I think, at least on Carroll O'Connor's part, money was an issue. I can't see him doing guest-stints and agreeing not to be paid amply for it. And since CBS tried to screw him time and time again, I wouldn't put it past CBS to not think he was worth it. I could be wrong, but until someone proves otherwise, I stand by my guess.

Ed

I would think that since AITF was so big and Carroll O'Connor the main star, there was likely not much time for him to appear on other shows. No doubt the shooting schedule was demanding for AITF as well as it's spin-offs. In addition, Archie was not friendly with Maude or the Jeffersons. There really wouldn't be a script-worthy reason for him to appear.

[TVFactFan]

I would think that since AITF was so big and Carroll O'Connor the main star, there was likely not much time for him to appear on other shows. No doubt the shooting schedule was demanding for AITF as well as it's spin-offs. In addition, Archie was not friendly with Maude or the Jeffersons. There really wouldn't be a script-worthy
reason for him to appear.


I agree, it would have only made sense for Edith or Mike to appear on the Jeffersons. And as far as Maude, only Edith