Cases you were sure were homicides

[mikewho]

Was curios what cases everyone would choose that they just knew we're homicides even though other scenarios were brought up as possibilities?

[XCalibur]

Very common theme on Unsolved Mysteries. Ive sometimes wondered if one of the goals of the show was to expose corrupt and lazy law enforcement, and I myself have expressed a low opinion of the police many times. Of course, there is no way of knowing they could always be right, but the fundamental truth is its easier to write something off as a suicide than to investiagte a murder.

Rae Ann Mosser
Crystal Spencer
Cindi James
Jeffery Digman
Tony Lombardi
Andre Jones
Keith Warren

There are some others I have in mind and I simply can't recall the names. These are all cases that I wouldn't be surprised if everyone of them were murders, and they were written off as suicide, with the exception of Rae Ann Mosser which I think was probably manslaughter.

[WishfulDreamer]

Rae Ann Mosser
Crystal Spencer
Kurt McFall
Keith Warren
Norman Ladner
Tommy Burkett

[Corkys-Place]

Sadly, I think Ashley Freeman and Laura Bible are no longer with us.

[MegtheEgg86]

I still maintain Mike Riemer was killed by a third party.

[mikewho]

The Keith warren case really stands out for me. It was clear that foul play was involved.

[TheCars1986]

I still maintain Mike Riemer was killed by a third party.

Ditto. I've always thought (even before his remains were found) that a serial killer was responsible for his and Diana Robertson's death.

[RobinW]

Dave Bocks and Danny Casolaro. No way either of those were suicides!

[asmitty]

Ditto. I've always thought (even before his remains were found) that a serial killer was responsible for his and Diana Robertson's death.

Agreed. Mike being the killer of the earlier victims and then killing Diana didn't add up. Two couples being murdered by the same killer is a much more consistent scenario.

Just a few of them that stuck out for me...

Keith Warren
Jayson Artis
David Bocks
Robert Dirscherl
Charles Morgan

[amandab1234]

Was curios what cases everyone would choose that they just knew we're homicides even though other scenarios were brought up as possibilities?


I'm going to say Wendy Camp was a homicide.

[Corky Kneivel]

I will never understand how people think Tony Lombardi was murdered. Of all the UM segments that make really strong cases for an unexplained death or ruled suicide actually being a murder:

Dan Casolaro
Bobby Fuller
Keith Warren
Dr. Zel Losef
Ives & Henry
Tommy Burkett
Mike Reimer
Dave Bocks
The two friends on the military base
The spy Ralph something
The CIA guy who was dosed with LSD



…the Tony Lombardi segment doesn’t stand up to any sort of scrutiny. I never thought it was anything but suicide from the very first viewing and I fully understand it’s my own hard headedness but I can’t understand how people think it was a murder.

[WishfulDreamer]

Dave Bocks and Danny Casolaro. No way either of those were suicides!
I agree 1 million percent.


Also, Doug Johnston. What moron could have proposed suicide when no gun was at the scene?!

[Steve W.]

The Keith warren case really stands out for me. It was clear that foul play was involved.

definitely

I think he was held down or in place by two or more people and forced to inhale/swallow the deadly chemicals that were later found in his body.

[mikewho]

Didn't Keith warren have leaves on his back as if being hoisted up?

Yeah I think Dave bocks was def murdered.

I think mike riemer was killed the same time his wife was and they just missed him in the search. I dont remember all the details of what they found but seems like he was found a mile away from where his wife was found. The note in the truck didn't make sense though.

[Clockworkhigh]

Ditto. I've always thought (even before his remains were found) that a serial killer was responsible for his and Diana Robertson's death.

Yeah, same here. I know people think it is strange that a serial killer would leave their little girl unharmed and actually go out of the way to drive her to a shopping mall, but I believe even a serial killer can have a limit when it comes to young children who aren't even old enough to tie their shoes. So the killer had to put her in a place where she would be found safe and sound because by the sounds of it she'd have frozen to death had she stayed out in the forest.

I also found it strange there were no leads or any proof that Mike was alive. No sightings as far as I can remember, and if there were, well, we know they were wrong now. Mike was painted as a shady guy and maybe he had friends in low places so you never know who he was mixed up with, or Diana.

I don't get how people can think Cindy James was murdered. I don't know why, but she strikes a chord in me and is similar to a woman a dated before I met my wife. She did all the things I think Cindy did, cried for attention, embellished things, cried wolf and out of all the times she was "tied up" she never got a good glimpse of the person. No, in my mind she was her own worst enemy, maybe split personalities.

[TheCars1986]

Also, Doug Johnston. What moron could have proposed suicide when no gun was at the scene?!

Good one! Yeah it's funny how LE wants us to believe Doug Johnston stretched his arm to the back of his head, shot himself, and then the gun decided to get up and walk way...:rolleyes:

[WishfulDreamer]

Good one! Yeah it's funny how LE wants us to believe Doug Johnston stretched his arm to the back of his head, shot himself, and then the gun decided to get up and walk way...:rolleyes:

Didn't they finally reverse the ruling and change it to homicide? I really hope so but it's ridiculous they ever tried to say that he shot himself! This is one of the most incompetent investigations ever on UM, in my opinion...same with Casalaro. "Oh, yes. I slit my wrists twelve times." Give me a break! Besides him being scared of blood and needles, the thought that they could believe twelve deep gashes could be administered against oneself is pretty ridiculous. Chuck Morgan's death is more debatable, but that bullet proof vest is quite telling. I believe they were all murdered. Johnston's death ruling is still the silliest in my mind.

[UMFaninMD]

I don't get how people can think Cindy James was murdered. I don't know why, but she strikes a chord in me and is similar to a woman a dated before I met my wife. She did all the things I think Cindy did, cried for attention, embellished things, cried wolf and out of all the times she was "tied up" she never got a good glimpse of the person. No, in my mind she was her own worst enemy, maybe split personalities.

I don't think this was a homicide either. Maybe one day I'll be proven wrong but for now, I think she did this to herself. Everytime I think of Cindy James I think of the Ruth Finley (http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20099840,00.html) case and maybe something that happened to her in her past triggered what took place.

[RobinW]

Good one! Yeah it's funny how LE wants us to believe Doug Johnston stretched his arm to the back of his head, shot himself, and then the gun decided to get up and walk way...:rolleyes:

I've tried to rationalize how the hell LE thought they would be able to explain no being gun found at a suicide scene. I wonder if their cover story was going to be that some random person came across the scene and just decided to steal the gun and run away. Of course, that's very, VERY unlikely, but I don't know what other explanation they could have possibly dreamed up!

[Thiussat]

I don't think this was a homicide either. Maybe one day I'll be proven wrong but for now, I think she did this to herself. Everytime I think of Cindy James I think of the Ruth Finley (http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20099840,00.html) case and maybe something that happened to her in her past triggered what took place.

Excellent example. I have heard of that case before, but only snippets here and there. It definitely sounds almost identical to the Cindy James story.

[Thiussat]

I will never understand how people think Tony Lombardi was murdered. Of all the UM segments that make really strong cases for an unexplained death or ruled suicide actually being a murder:

…the Tony Lombardi segment doesn’t stand up to any sort of scrutiny. I never thought it was anything but suicide from the very first viewing and I fully understand it’s my own hard headedness but I can’t understand how people think it was a murder.

I'm with you 100% and have posted my analysis of why in other threads. There is no evidence whatsoever that Lombardi was murdered. All of the "evidence" presented is merely the result of a family who cannot accept the ruling of suicide. All of their evidence was gleaned from "anonymous" contacts, etc.

This is not uncommon at all, most families do not accept suicide. It's why you never see "suicide" in an obituary for example. This is also why I do not put any stock in what the family has to say. Only independent parties can be neutral in a case like that.

However, you and I are alone. I would say 95% of the regular posters here are absolutely determined that Lombardi was murdered.


I've tried to rationalize how the hell LE thought they would be able to explain no being gun found at a suicide scene. I wonder if their cover story was going to be that some random person came across the scene and just decided to steal the gun and run away. Of course, that's very, VERY unlikely, but I don't know what other explanation they could have possibly dreamed up!

I just watched this segment again. Basically what happened is the coroner said that the gunshot could have been either self-inflicted or a murder. Remember the coroner is sort of working in a vacuum. He is supposed to make a determination based on the BODY alone. So, the detectives had to pretty much go with his ruling (undetermined).

However, the detectives know there was no gun at the scene, so obviously they realize that it was almost 100% a murder. So, it's not a case of the cops being dumb or lazy, but rather a case of the coroner saying one thing and the physical evidence at the scene saying something else entirely. Apparently the cops were forced to go with the coroner's ruling of "undetermined." Obviously we all know it was a murder, and I am sure the cops do as well. I think the "formal" ruling of "undetermined" is what has people saying "OMG the cops are stupid" when the cops themselves did not make that ruling.

Also, there is no reason to believe the cops ever thought it was a suicide. Robert Stack said "On first glance it appeared to be suicide." But I think that was more of a figure of speech than something the Cops themselves had said. Stack never said the Cops said it looked like suicide. They may have walked up to the car and thought for 10 seconds "suicide," but I am sure when they found no gun that changed.

[TheCars1986]

Didn't they finally reverse the ruling and change it to homicide? I really hope so but it's ridiculous they ever tried to say that he shot himself! This is one of the most incompetent investigations ever on UM, in my opinion...same with Casalaro. "Oh, yes. I slit my wrists twelve times." Give me a break! Besides him being scared of blood and needles, the thought that they could believe twelve deep gashes could be administered against oneself is pretty ridiculous. Chuck Morgan's death is more debatable, but that bullet proof vest is quite telling. I believe they were all murdered. Johnston's death ruling is still the silliest in my mind.

IIRC, Johnston's death is still ruled as "undetermined". As for Casalaro, I think there's a decent chance that he did in fact kill himself.

[Mystery Man]

Tommy Burkett, most certainly.

[SheRaaa]

Keith Warren

Rae Ann Mosser

The boys on the tracks

[rhzunam]

However, you and I are alone. I would say 95% of the regular posters here are absolutely determined that Lombardi was murdered.

I also totally believe he killed himself.

[mikewho]

I'll have to go back and watch the case again but last time I watched the Lombardi case I was kind of mixed on it and thought it could have gone either way. Is that the case where his mom saw his room light on and possibly heard someone leaving?

[Necco]

Ok. I'll say it. Kurt Cobain. From the moment he was discovered I was convinced Courtney had him killed, long before any conspiracies grew.


Let the mocking begin. :crazy:

[MegtheEgg86]

I was never at all sold on the notion that Melissa Jo Sermons killed Larry Costine. I always thought her ex-boyfriend had been waiting for them both in the trailer, killed Larry, and then took Jo somewhere else to do the same thing to her. Apparently he had confessed as much before he died, but of course that's a little more difficult to tell with Jo still being missing.

[dks64]

I still maintain Mike Riemer was killed by a third party.

I never doubted it for a moment. I always had a gut feeling about the case. I was certain his body was nearby, I was glad when he was finally discovered.

[TheCars1986]

Dale Williams and Lee Young were almost certainly homicides.

[MegtheEgg86]

I always had a gut feeling about the case.

Me too. I wasn't surprised at all when his skull was found. The undergrowth is so thick in the deeply wooded areas of western WA that I can definitely see how he might have been missed for months and subsequently decades afterward.

I think TheCars1986 and I have a similar theory on this one (Cars if you're reading and I'm mistaken correct me). I think there's a good chance Mike and Diana were killed by someone familiar to them (and that someone was NOT the same person who killed Steven Harkins and Ruth Cooper). I've kind of held to that possibility for about four years now--the more I consider it against other scenarios, the more it makes sense to me.

[TheCars1986]

Me too. I wasn't surprised at all when his skull was found. The undergrowth is so thick in the deeply wooded areas of western WA that I can definitely see how he might have been missed for months and subsequently decades afterward.

I think TheCars1986 and I have a similar theory on this one (Cars if you're reading and I'm mistaken correct me). I think there's a good chance Mike and Diana were killed by someone familiar to them (and that someone was NOT the same person who killed Steven Harkins and Ruth Cooper). I've kind of held to that possibility for about four years now--the more I consider it against other scenarios, the more it makes sense to me.

I think it's a strong possibility that whoever killed Mike and Diana was known to both of them. I also have always theorized that Diana could have been the object of the killer's affections, and killed Mike out of jealousy/anger over the way he treated Diana. That would also explain the "I LOVE YOU DIANA" note found on the dash of Riemer's truck and (if Diana balked at the killers advances) it could account for the violent nature in which she was killed.

[mikewho]

The boys on the tracks was obvious to me foul play was involved. Didn they prove that one of the boys was stabbed?

I also rewatched the Doug Johnston case and nothing about it made me think of suicide. Shot behind the ear by at least 12 inches. If I shot myself behind the ear it would most likely be pressed against my ear and def close to it. Also the gun would be easily found.