Lessons in Classic Rock - Lesson 1

[coily2]

Since I am appalled at the lack of knowledge of the history of excellent rock, I am going to take a personal interest in educating all of you (Bootsy, Cokies, you two are excused).

Lesson 1 - Deep Purple

Deep Purple has been rocking strong for 33 years now. They are one of the most influencial bands of the 70's in the hard rock genre, and for sure one of the most enduring. Please go to your favorite napster alternative and download "Highway Star", "Smoke on Water", and "Woman From Tokyo" and listen. Keep in mind that most metal/hair/hard rock bands that came to prominence in the 1980s have listed Deep Purple as a primary influence.

Get downloading!

[Devon King]

Nifty idea, Prof. coily2!

<hand up, waving madly> Um, when do we get the lesson on pre-MTV Eric Clapton and Cream? <grin>

[This message has been edited by Devon King (edited 07-05-2001).]

[Bootsy Whoosh]

With utmost respect to coily2, I'll attempt to field this one. (hopefully she won't mind http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/wink.gif )

Lesson 2 - Cream.

Cream were together for only a few years, but in that time they were immensly successful and influential.

At the peak of their success in the late 1960s, Cream were as popular as the Beatles and Jimi Hendrix. They were extremely popular both in the US and their native UK.

Cream had a unique sound that was a mix of rock, blues, R&B, and psychedelic rock (ah the good ol' late 1960s drug induced rock!)

Run to your nearest Napster alternative and download "Sunshine of Your Love" (you may actually recognize the riff on this one)and "White Room".

Cream is the group that really propelled Eric Clapton to the forefront, though he had previously played guitar for the Yardbirds, Blind Faith and Derek and the Dominos.

Clapton is one of the best guitar players of his generation. Clapton's unique style earned him the nickname "slowhand".

Clapton has a whole long string of hits you could download. My personal favorites are "Layla" (the most famous version was with Derek and the Dominos), "I Shot the Sheriff", "Wonderful Tonight", and "Cocaine". The younger people here may actually have heard his early 1990s hit, "Tears in Heaven", but then that wouldn't fall under pre-MTV.


Who's next? Is there anyone in particular people want to learn more about?

[coily2]

Originally posted by Bootsy Whoosh:
The younger people here may actually have heard his early 1990s hit, "Tears in Heaven", but then that wouldn't fall under pre-MTV.


Layla was also done acoustically on this album, and it is frightening how many people think of this as Layla, and not the Derek and the Dominos version.

[Cokies]

Great lesson Coily! Deep Purple's "Hush" happens to be one of my all-time favorites. Most youngins' have only heard the "new" Kula Shaker cover of "Hush". But in no way, does it live up to Deep Purple's version.

And Bootsy, wasn't Cream known as the first supergroup? "White Room" is classic, by the way. Thumbs up on that one.

Keep up with the excellent lessons! Maybe I can think of some myself... http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/wink.gif



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" I love the dark, I love the dark. But I hate nature. I HATE nature ." - Chunk

[Mossopp]

Originally posted by Cokies:
Great lesson Coily! Deep Purple's "Hush" happens to be one of my all-time favorites. Most youngins' have only heard the "new" Kula Shaker cover of "Hush". But in no way, does it live up to Deep Purple's version.



Cokies, I'm very impressed with your knowledge of British music. I didn't realise how many of our bands actually made it over to the States.
Although I wish to apologise profusely for us Brits inflicting Kula Shaker upon the world!

And this "Lessons in Classic Rock" is a brillaint idea! But let's not forget greats like Black Sabbath, Guns N Roses and the mighty Meatloaf.

------------------
"This life has been a test. If it were an actual life you would have recieved instructions on where to go and what to do."
- Angela, 'My So-called Life'

"...everything was there and around us. We knew exactly who we were and exactly where we were going. It was grand."
- Gordie, 'Stand By Me'

Please visit Mossopp's TV Corner -
http://members3.boardhost.com/TVcorner

[Cokies]

Originally posted by Mossopp:

Cokies, I'm very impressed with your knowledge of British music. I didn't realise how many of our bands actually made it over to the States.
Although I wish to apologise profusely for us Brits inflicting Kula Shaker upon the world!



Oh, I love British music. I mean, I'm an American, and I can admit that Brits usually are the better musicians and songwriters. The only American songwriter that can be compared to them could only be Bob Dylan.

But yeah, Brits usually make a splurge over here. Not as big as the invasion in the early 60's, but we've had our share. The last "invasion" would have to be that of Oasis and Blur. "What's the Story, Morning Glory" was a pretty big album over here, and the single "Wonderwall" was a top ten hit. "Champagne Supernova" was also a popular one. Too bad "Don't Look Back In Anger" wasn't as big, for in my opinion is Oasis' best song ever. ( Up there with "Live Forever").
Right now, Coldplay is getting radio play with "Yellow", while Travis is a favorite as well. Personally, I wish the Manic Street Preachers would make it big over here.
Sorry, I'm just rambling now. I'll shut up.
But keep up with the lessons!

[Miller15]

Coily2,
This is an excellent idea! I'm so sick of people who are completely unaware of anything recorded before 1990. You know, these are the people who think Smashmouth wrote "I'm a Beliver," or that Puff Daddy is an original artitst. Keep up the good work! I just hope some of those who are less aware of classic rock read these posts, instead of those who already have a fair amount of knowledge on the subject. http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Bootsy Whoosh]

Miller, that's exactly what I was thinking. I was thinking, me, Cokies, coily2 and probably only a handful of others are the only ones actually reading this, LOL.

Also, ditto your statement about music recorded before 1990. One day, on the radio, they were playing the Eurythemics' "Sweet Dreams", and some guy called in and goes "Dude...someone made a cover of a Marilyn Manson song?"

[lesliem14]

I read this and I'm enjoying it! This gets really dated in terms of cover songs, but when I was 9 or 10 my dad and I had this conversation:

(in the car-classic rock station, song comes on)
L: Oh, that's the Wonder Years theme song
D: (Shaking his head) No, that's the Joe Cocker version of a Beatles's song.
L: Really? I didn't know that.
D: If your my daughter you better remember that.

End of conversation. That song became my high school class song (and it's very wise when your practicing it for Honors Day that the person bringing it in bring the Beatles's version and not the one by Joe Cocker from Woodstock).

The Smashmouth version (which I admit I do like, so shoot me) of the Monkees's song, I had to laugh today coming home from work. This radio station I listen to does a top five countdown of the 5 most requested songs of the day. Fourth was the Smashmouth version which was playing when I turned the ignition on. I turned it up and then turned it down when the song went off. The dj decided instead of playing the no 3 song then to play the Monkees's version. I got so excited and turned the radio up even louder!!!!!!!!!!! It was a fun ride home! Everclear has a cover of "Brown-eyed girl" that is wierd.

My problem with classic rock is that I know a lot of songs, but half the time I don't know who sings them or what the song name is. coily-I probably have heard that group sometime or another (should probably look through my father's record collection), but I can't remember. Classic rock is so awesome though. Much better then 95% of the stuff being produced today.

[Lynn]

Don't worry, I'm reading. I'm an eager student that could use a lesson or two on classic rock.

Lesliem, I'm the same way - I've heard the songs but I never know what the title is or who the singers are.

[coily2]

Originally posted by lesliem14:
Everclear has a cover of "Brown-eyed girl" that is wierd.


I used to consider myself a fan of Everclear, but this song disgusts me. They destroyed a classic, and a whole generation of little MTV teeny-boppers are going to forever think that's the way that song is supposed to sound. One day they'll hear the Van Morrison version and say to their friend, "Whoever did this screwed up this song."

I really hate it when big MTV bands cover songs. Its an act of laziness and sometimes of desperation. They want to stay popular and in the public's eye, but rather than writing their own songs, they borrow someone else's tried and true song.

Anyhow, back on topic, I don't think that the people who were meant to read this are either! Oh well. I'm having fun, pulling out all my old Deep Purple albums I haven't listened to in ages (yes, they actually are albums, not cds, not tapes... that's how old they are). But for the next lesson, I was actually thinking of another Brit band - Pink Floyd.

[Cokies]

Originally posted by coily2:


Anyhow, back on topic, I don't think that the people who were meant to read this are either! Oh well. I'm having fun, pulling out all my old Deep Purple albums I haven't listened to in ages (yes, they actually are albums, not cds, not tapes... that's how old they are). But for the next lesson, I was actually thinking of another Brit band - Pink Floyd.

Yes, lesson on Pink Floyd. That would be excellent. Of course you're going to discuss "Dark Side of the Moon".

[Bootsy Whoosh]

Originally posted by Cokies:
Yes, lesson on Pink Floyd. That would be excellent. Of course you're going to discuss "Dark Side of the Moon".


And the Wall right? That entire album is great, and the movie is good too.

[coily2]

The Wall and Dark Side of the Moon are excellent albums, but I was thinking actually of Animals - not as popular but every bit as good. I need to tap Mr. Coily's brain on this one. He is the knower of all things Pink Floyd. I wouldn't want to spread mis-information.

[Miller15]

Originally posted by coily2:
I used to consider myself a fan of Everclear, but this song disgusts me. They destroyed a classic, and a whole generation of little MTV teeny-boppers are going to forever think that's the way that song is supposed to sound. One day they'll hear the Van Morrison version and say to their friend, "Whoever did this screwed up this song."

I really hate it when big MTV bands cover songs. Its an act of laziness and sometimes of desperation. They want to stay popular and in the public's eye, but rather than writing their own songs, they borrow someone else's tried and true song.



YES YES YES YES YES!!!!!!! Oh man, it could not have been said any better than that, coily2!!! I almost started busting heads when someone said to me, "Steven Tyler is a genius for writing 'Come Together.'" Although, I have nothing against Aerosmith, just the ignorance of some people. Maddness and utter chaos would have ensued if I heard someone say that they thought "Sweet Dreams" was a Marilyn Manson original. I don't know, I'm just real big on giving credit where credit is due, you know?

[This message has been edited by Miller15 (edited 07-07-2001).]

[Penny Lane]

How about OzzY and
Black Sabbath's "Paranoid"? Cool!

[This message has been edited by NEWHART FAN (edited 07-07-2001).]

[This message has been edited by NEWHART FAN (edited 07-08-2001).]

[Devon King]

Originally posted by Miller15:
Maddness and utter chaos would have ensued if I heard someone say that they thought "Sweet Dreams" was a Marilyn Manson original. I don't know, I'm just real big on giving credit where credit is due, you know?

[This message has been edited by Miller15 (edited 07-07-2001).][/B]

While we're on the subject of lack of originality and giving credit to the folk who came up with the original songs and melodies .. *mini-rant warning!*

I am beyond sick of talentless, studio-created performers "sampling" the best licks from older songs and then spinning out some recycled "hey-dig-me-ain't-I-cool?" neo-pop version that jumps straight up the charts and convinces the younger audience that these McSongs are original thoughts and creations!

Cover the song if you must -- but don't cannibalize it, add some processed cheese and expect me to buy it.

(*ahem!* Woah, got a little carried away there, sorry!)

Love all the fab classic tune talk! Keep going with the lessons!

[Cokies]

Originally posted by Devon King:



Cover the song if you must -- but don't cannibalize it, add some processed cheese and expect me to buy it.



Exactly! I mean, the covers that are 'good' are usually live, and done in honor of the original band or artist.
That can NOT be said of Britney Spears recent HORRIFIC cover of the Stones' "Satisfaction" . If anything is cannalbalism, it's that single.

[Miller15]

Originally posted by Devon King:
I am beyond sick of talentless, studio-created performers "sampling" the best licks from older songs and then spinning out some recycled "hey-dig-me-ain't-I-cool?" neo-pop version that jumps straight up the charts and convinces the younger audience that these McSongs are original thoughts and creations!

Perfect. All I can say is perfect.

[coily2]

AMEN, Devon King.

K-RAD MTV Bands suck. Period.

[lesliem14]

Originally posted by Cokies:
That can NOT be said of Britney Spears recent HORRIFIC cover of the Stones' "Satisfaction" . If anything is cannalbalism, it's that single.



Oh lord -I was really trying to pretend that she ever did that or that she existed....

[triple19]

Originally posted by Devon King:
I am beyond sick of talentless, studio-created performers "sampling" the best licks from older songs and then spinning out some recycled "hey-dig-me-ain't-I-cool?" neo-pop version that jumps straight up the charts and convinces the younger audience that these McSongs are original thoughts and creations!

Cover the song if you must -- but don't cannibalize it, add some processed cheese and expect me to buy it.



That's exactly why I don't watch MTV or bother to listen to TOP 40 music stations anymore. I'll take VH1 and classic rock/classic oldies radio anytime over the McPop of N'Sync or Britney Spears. As far as I'm concerned, thier stuff ain't music. It's manufactured garbage.

[Mossopp]

Someone referred to Britney's cover of 'Satisfaction' as "cannibalism". While I am inclined to agree, I wish to put forward an even more brutal dissection of a classic song -

The abominable cover of 'Sweet Child O' Mine" by Sheryl Crow.

HOW COULD SHE DO THAT?!!!!!!

I was sick after hearing what she did to that wonderful song!

[Miller15]

AAAHHHH! Please, do NOT remind me of such heinous things!

I am SO glad that I've found some people who agree with me about these ungodly rip-offs. I was scared for a while that my sister and I were the only ones who ranted for hours about this! You guys rock! http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Bootsy Whoosh]

Originally posted by Mossopp:
Someone referred to Britney's cover of 'Satisfaction' as "cannibalism". While I am inclined to agree, I wish to put forward an even more brutal dissection of a classic song -

The abominable cover of 'Sweet Child O' Mine" by Sheryl Crow.

HOW COULD SHE DO THAT?!!!!!!

I was sick after hearing what she did to that wonderful song!

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif Gag! I like Sheryl Crow and all, but I agree, this should never have happened.

Speaking of Guns N' Roses though, I love them too and all, but I'm not a huge fan of their cover of Mama Kin. It could've been alot worse, but the original is leaps and bounds better. Of course originals are almost always better.

[FolFanatic151]

Hey, I skimmed this post and saw some stuff about the Monkees. I just went to a Monkees concert on Thursday (minus Michael Naismith...maybe he thought that cool green hat made him too good for the Monkees http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif )! It was soooo great! They all actually looked pretty good (except Micky Dolenz had a pretty bad comb-over.) Just thought I'd tell you people. Also, I swear Micky was looking at me during "I'm Not Your Steppin' Stone" http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[coily2]

I think that an argument can be made that the Monkees were the original fabricated boy band. they were created for the sole purpose of riding in the wake of the Beatles success. Why do you think they were called "The pre-fab four"?

[FolFanatic151]

Speaking of the Monkees being a boy's band, after the opening band (some wanna-be *Nsync/Backstreet Boys) Peter Tork got all hunched over and talked like he had no teeth and was like, "We used to be a boy's band." It was pretty funny...I guess you had to be there...I don't know.

[triple19]

Originally posted by coily2:
I think that an argument can be made that the Monkees were the original fabricated boy band. they were created for the sole purpose of riding in the wake of the Beatles success. Why do you think they were called "The pre-fab four"?

I agree with you there, Coily. But but unlike the Backstreet Boys, N'sync, or the other boy-bands out there today, the Monkees weren't ripping off other peoples music and passing it off as thier own. In fact, they had some of the best singer-songwriters such as Neil Diamond and Carol King writing songs for them.

In fact,they were all singers and/or musicians. Mike Nesmith was a folk singer. Peter Tork was classically trained on several instruments. Micky Dolenz played in a rock band called Micky and the One Nighters before his Monkee days. And Davy Jones had starred on Broadway in the musical "Oliver!" prior to the Monkees.

Also, unlike the boy-bands out there today, the guys got sick of being musically controlled by the system that created them in the first place. They fought to play thier own instruments. After that they wrote, played, and produced thier own records. Some of those albums were quite good, and they still had hit songs. Mind you, at the same time while they were doing this, the guys were in a weekly TV show as well. Has any boy-band (other than maybe the Partrige family) to date, equalled that feat?

And consider this, thirty plus years after they started, the Monkees still have a huge following, and still have sell out concerts. Will the Backstreet Boys or N'sync still have the kind of appeal and success that the Monkees have had 30 years from now? I don't know. Time will tell.

Okay, I'll get off my soapbox now.

(By the way, if it isn't obvious by now, I am a big fan of the Monkees)

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-23-2001).]

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-23-2001).]

[ckrtpametulia]

ive read all of this now i have lessons

[Miller15]

Thank you, triple19! So many people don't realize that the Monkees did have musical talent...they just weren't allowed to use it at first.

For anyone who needs someone to compare these new boy bands to, I suggest you not use The Beatles or The Monkees...try maybe...New Kids on the Block. After all, that's exactly what NSYNC and Backstreet Boys, and all those other boy bands are...they're New Kids, 10 years later.

Also, I just want to point out that music (like most of life) goes in cycles. Think about this...a lot of what was popular in the 50s was studio manufactured music. Very much like these boy bands, they had professional songwriters, and were pretty much under the control of record labels and managers and such...then, in the 60s and 70s, the whole singer/songwriter vibe took over. (In my opinion, some of the best music ever written came from this era) We've now come back to controlling record labels just trying to make the quickest dollar possible. Eventually, this whole thing will fade away and we'll get back to hearing music with real feeling, performed by real artists with musical talent.

All right, I guess I've rambled on way too much. I just have so much respect and love for real music.

So...wrap your minds around that! http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/smile.gif

[triple19]

Originally posted by Miller15:
[B

Also, I just want to point out that music (like most of life) goes in cycles. Think about this...a lot of what was popular in the 50s was studio manufactured music. Very much like these boy bands, they had professional songwriters, and were pretty much under the control of record labels and managers and such...then, in the 60s and 70s, the whole singer/songwriter vibe took over. (In my opinion, some of the best music ever written came from this era) We've now come back to controlling record labels just trying to make the quickest dollar possible. Eventually, this whole thing will fade away and we'll get back to hearing music with real feeling, performed by real artists with musical talent.

[/B]


Well said, Miller15! I love the music that the singers and songwriters from the 70's created. The sooner we get back to that type of era, the better off the state of current music will be. No more boy-bands, please!

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-24-2001).]

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-24-2001).]

[Bootsy Whoosh]

Originally posted by Miller15:
[B]Also, I just want to point out that music (like most of life) goes in cycles. Think about this...a lot of what was popular in the 50s was studio manufactured music. Very much like these boy bands, they had professional songwriters, and were pretty much under the control of record labels and managers and such...then, in the 60s and 70s, the whole singer/songwriter vibe took over. (In my opinion, some of the best music ever written came from this era) We've now come back to controlling record labels just trying to make the quickest dollar possible. Eventually, this whole thing will fade away and we'll get back to hearing music with real feeling, performed by real artists with musical talent.
B]

I agree with you Miller, and I've noticed this trend too. You can even extend it to say that the trend differentiates between thoughtful music with a message and just simple, pop music with no real message (but let's not forget that pop music can be fun to listen to!).

50s-early 60s was mostly kind of bubblegum popish music like boy meets girl kind of stuff with no real message.

Early 60s-late 70s was mostly introspective rock and folk and music with a message (anti-war sentiments and all that rot).

Late 70s and 80s was nothing but disco and pop, mostly. Now, I like alot of 80s music, but let's face it, most of the music in the 80s was just plain fun, but it didn't always carry a heavy message with it.

Then the early 90s saw the grundge movement, and the rise of metal. Say what you will about grundge and metal, but most of it does have a message, most often social commentary on how much the world sucks http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

And now in the late 90s and early 2000s, we have a return to pop music and a rise in hip-hop, both with no real message. (sometimes good hip-hop will squeeze a message in).

Now of course there are exceptions to every category here, but when I talk about "70s music" or "80s music" I'm talking about what was popular then, what was getting radio play. I'm not talking about each and every single artist that was making music at that time.

Anyhoo, I predict the demise of the boy bands in about 2 years or less (I think they are already dying off) and then hopefully all the blonde cookie cutter girls will go with them, and then maybe we can get back to some good music with a message.

[FolFanatic151]

Originally posted by triple19:

And consider this, thirty plus years after they started, the Monkees still have a huge following, and still have sell out concerts. Will the Backstreet Boys or N'sync still have the kind of appeal and success that the Monkees have had 30 years from now? I don't know. Time will tell.

Okay, I'll get off my soapbox now.

(By the way, if it isn't obvious by now, I am a big fan of the Monkees)

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-23-2001).]

[This message has been edited by triple19 (edited 07-23-2001).]

I agree with that. There were huge Monkees fans at the concert. People of all ages, from about 7 to about 70, were there. I just thought that was great. I doubt that today's boy's bands could do that.

[Miller15]

Yeah, Bootsy...that's pretty much what I was trying to get at. http://www.sitcomsonline.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Robert Adams]

About Deep Purple and Cream...
To download the most potent Deep Purple stuff go for the truly blistering hypersublime tracks from the "In Rock" album: Speed King, Child in Time, and Hard Lovin' Man. That was the record that blew the lid off for DP. It came after the DP with the London Symphony record and really set fire to the whole Deep Purple success story. Cream was certainly, as the name indicated, the combination of top talents doing long improvised solos. Ginger Baker, Jack Bruce, and EC were all brilliant. No wonder it blew apart. For anyone that likes EC though, it's more than worthwhile exploring his "Bluesbreaker" era with John Mayall. His playing with that band was brilliant and, for musicians of that era, was mindblowing. Along the Cream lines too, some of the more recent Jack Bruce tunes with Gary Moore are excellent updates of things like NSU.