2 Questions

[PhilaEaglesHater]

Since I was too young at the time to remember the fued with Valerie and the Producers, what was the problem that Valerie Harper with the show/producers/?


How was her death explained on the show?

[Brian Damage]

I don't exactly remember what the feud was, I remember her wanting more money, but she died in a car accident.

[PhilaEaglesHater]

I don't exactly remember what the feud was, I remember her wanting more money, but she died in a car accident.



I guess they remembered that explanation from Good Times-lol

[Brian Damage]

very true, although Valeries death on the show was explained to have happened a few months prior.

[James"Thunder"Early]

Since I was too young at the time to remember the fued with Valerie and the Producers, what was the problem that Valerie Harper with the show/producers/?


How was her death explained on the show?Valerie Harper wanted more money and creative control. The producers said she walked off the show, she claims she was fired. Lorimar sued her for 70 million for breach of contract, Valerie countersued for 180 million. One producer even said she screamed and yelled on the set.

[PhilaEaglesHater]

Valerie Harper wanted more money and creative control. The producers said she walked off the show, she claims she was fired. Lorimar sued her for 70 million for breach of contract, Valerie countersued for 180 million. One producer even said she screamed and yelled on the set.



I'm a little confused as to why Valerie wanted more money because the show was never higher than #20 in the ratings while she was on the show. I thought you ask for more money when a TV show is a HIT-lol

[James"Thunder"Early]

I'm a little confused as to why Valerie wanted more money because the show was never higher than #20 in the ratings while she was on the show. I thought you ask for more money when a TV show is a HIT-lolThe ratings we're good enough to keep the show on and when they came up slighty, she asked for more money. She did the same thing on Rhoda, but in that case they gave it to her.

[PhilaEaglesHater]

The ratings we're good enough to keep the show on and when they came up slighty, she asked for more money. She did the same thing on Rhoda, but in that case they gave it to her.


But you can't ask for more money when the Ratings go up SLIGHTLY, they have to Really Go Up. If the Ratings go up Slightly, that's just keeping all the cast members employed. Not something to start be Arrogant about.

[Brian Damage]

But you can't ask for more money when the Ratings go up SLIGHTLY, they have to Really Go Up. If the Ratings go up Slightly, that's just keeping all the cast members employed. Not something to start be Arrogant about.

I agree with you. The show wasn't a bonafide hit to be asking for a huge amount of money.

[James"Thunder"Early]

But you can't ask for more money when the Ratings go up SLIGHTLY, they have to Really Go Up. If the Ratings go up Slightly, that's just keeping all the cast members employed. Not something to start be Arrogant about.I agree, the show never ranked really high enough for her to demand that much money. She also wanted creative control after just one season.

[ClassicTVGal]

Well I'm glad to see 'some' explaination. But that doesn't mean I believe *all* of it. I know not evreyone is as they seem, but Valerie seems to be an extremely nice person. I mean I even have a friend that has met her more than once! (Lucky her, right? LOL)

[PhilaEaglesHater]

Well I'm glad to see 'some' explaination. But that doesn't mean I believe *all* of it. I know not evreyone is as they seem, but Valerie seems to be an extremely nice person. I mean I even have a friend that has met her more than once! (Lucky her, right? LOL)


It was still strange to demand a raise when the show wasn't a top 5 Show

[Edster2973]

Just to clarify: Yes, Valerie Harper did want a substantial raise increase and more of a voice in creating the episodes, but the producers agreed to this and she came back to work. She was on strike for one episode that the show shot without her, then the producers & Harper came to an agreement and she was back at work. They re-shot the episode to include her in it and things were well, or so she thought.

While in a costume fitting for another episode, Harper received the notice that she had been sacked and replaced by Sandy Duncan. No one knows why this reversal took place, not even the cast, who reportedly were devastated that she had been fired. What probably happened is that some head honcho at Lorimar or NBC didn't give the final "OK" to Miller & Boyett to give in to Harper so to appease the big boss, the decision was made to fire her instead. Then came the lies that she was fired because of her contract demands and so forth. After this, the Season 3 premiere episode was re-shot a second time (totalling 3 takes in all) with Duncan as the new female lead with the explanation that Valerie Hogan had been deceased for 6 months from a car crash.

Harper had the documentation to back up her claims that all had been settled and finalized and that she was back at work, ready for a full season, which is why she ultimately won in court.

So the argument shouldn't really be whether Harper should've asked for more money, but why her producers gave in to her (it was only a 15% raise that she got by the way) and then fired her.


Ed

[PhilaEaglesHater]

Just to clarify: Yes, Valerie Harper did want a substantial raise increase and more of a voice in creating the episodes, but the producers agreed to this and she came back to work. She was on strike for one episode that the show shot without her, then the producers & Harper came to an agreement and she was back at work. They re-shot the episode to include her in it and things were well, or so she thought.

While in a costume fitting for another episode, Harper received the notice that she had been sacked and replaced by Sandy Duncan. No one knows why this reversal took place, not even the cast, who reportedly were devastated that she had been fired. What probably happened is that some head honcho at Lorimar or NBC didn't give the final "OK" to Miller & Boyett to give in to Harper so to appease the big boss, the decision was made to fire her instead. Then came the lies that she was fired because of her contract demands and so forth. After this, the Season 3 premiere episode was re-shot a second time (totalling 3 takes in all) with Duncan as the new female lead with the explanation that Valerie Hogan had been deceased for 6 months from a car crash.

Harper had the documentation to back up her claims that all had been settled and finalized and that she was back at work, ready for a full season, which is why she ultimately won in court.

So the argument shouldn't really be whether Harper should've asked for more money, but why her producers gave in to her (it was only a 15% raise that she got by the way) and then fired her.


Ed


I just thought Valerie would have enough common sense to know that you only get a raise when the show is doing good things for the network. Sounds like Valerie had some shutoff notices-lol

[Edster2973]

I just thought Valerie would have enough common sense to know that you only get a raise when the show is doing good things for the network. Sounds like Valerie had some shutoff notices-lol

Well, in actuality, it was doing good things for NBC on Monday nights. The show, coupled with Alf, did extremely well, and was NBC's best ratings that it got on Monday nights for a few years. It definitely wasn't "Must See Thursday" ratings (that happened in the 90's, long after the show was cancelled) but the show was more than holding its own. Also, Jason Bateman's star was rising as a result of the show, and for Miller & Boyett, Valerie was popular enough that it was their hottest show at the time.

Raises are given all of the time in the industry, whether the show is in the top 5 or not. It depends on whether the show feels the person getting the raise is worth it or not. For Valerie, she was offered a 15% raise (hardly the huge amount of $$ that she was accused of demanding) and she agreed to it. The show was created by her and her husband, was named after her, and she felt that since the show was doing better that she should have more creative control and a raise to reflect that.

Besides, I think some of you are confused as to where the money would be coming from. The raise she was asking for was to come from Lorimar and Miller & Boyett, not NBC. For NBC to be involved, it most likely would have to mean that the network itself felt that the show was extremely valuable and for that to be, it'd have to be in the top 10 or something along those lines.

When a show is entering its second season, the salaries for all producers go up since it's increased the show's likelihood of going into syndication. Valerie waited until the third season to capitalize on that, and considering how Hollywood barters back and forth with its actors/actresses, it's hardly out of the realm of sanity.

Agree with it? Disagree with it? That's entirely up to you, but the thing is, she did get the raise and creative control, a new contract was signed, and she was back at work ready for Season 3. Then, without any explanation or notice, she was fired. Top 5 show or not, that kind of behavior is unprofessional and unfair. And boy, the show's producers paid for that in spades. Harper ended up proving this in court and ultimately ended up winning what she wanted and then some.

To have to dole out millions in damages as well as what she would've made on Valerie, and to give her partial ownership in the show on top of paying Sandy Duncan her leading female salary, hurt the companies big time. And during all of this, Jason Bateman was thus being paid more than what Valerie asked for, which shows that the money was there and there was more than enough to go around. Valerie must've known this; she wasn't stupid. And when one has all of the facts about what went down, one can see that she wasn't the greedy one, but the company producing the show was.

Ed

[Kristen]

Well I'm glad to see 'some' explaination. But that doesn't mean I believe *all* of it. I know not evreyone is as they seem, but Valerie seems to be an extremely nice person. I mean I even have a friend that has met her more than once! (Lucky her, right? LOL)

Gee, would that friend happen to be me?! ;)

As for the actual point of this thread, thanks, Ed, for clearing up this whole story on what happened between Valerie and the producers. I knew it was one of those things where she either quit or was fired and that there was some issue of money involved, I just never knew all the details.

- Kristen

[Edster2973]

As for the actual point of this thread, thanks, Ed, for clearing up this whole story on what happened between Valerie and the producers. I knew it was one of those things where she either quit or was fired and that there was some issue of money involved, I just never knew all the details.

- Kristen

No problem. It gets a bit annoying when people talk about the situation as if Valerie had brought the whole thing on herself. As you can see, that was hardly the case. Still, there are some who feel the need to still blame Valerie, saying that she never should've asked for the raise to begin with. It's almost as if some are afraid to agree that Valerie was screwed over because it might be interpreted as a slam against Sandy Duncan. That's ridiculous of course, but I don't see any other reasonable explanation.

There's an online interview where Valerie talks about her career, and she of course mentions Valerie and the courtcase that ensued. It's a great interview and I recommend listening to it in its entirety, but if you're interested only in the Valerie section, it starts at about 21:47. She talks about how the producers apologized to her and admitted that they treated her badly and that they're all friends now. Great stuff! It does take a while to load so be patient, but it's well worth it. And she gives a lot of cool insight in her career about The Mary Tyler Moore Show & Rhoda. Check it out:

http://www.houstonpbs.org/site/PageServer?pagename=con_innerviews_ernie

Scroll down to the right of the page at the Media on Demand section. Highly recommended!

Ed

[ClassicTVGal]

Gee, would that friend happen to be me?! ;)

Yes! LOL :D

[Clint Eastwood Fan]

Yes! LOL :D
Great sig. I'm waiting to see that SVU episode. It should be good. I miss Benson. :lol: